[Little Brave]

I'm looking at this M2. However, the carfax shows that the vehicle is originally from Quebec, Canada and brought into the US. Therefore, is it possible that some prior history of the vehicle could be missing? Also, would this vehicle throw up any red flags for you based on this information, or would yo proceed with the vehicle?

CarFax:
https://www.carfax.com/vehiclehistor...FuZ25S4-DqjByg

[E36 wire harness]

I think they use a lot of salt up there. Not the first place I would go looking for a used car.

[jefe2000]

You’ll probably get more specific advice for the M2 by posting your question over here in the M2 subforum:
http://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums

I notice a couple things from the CarFax report:

• That M2 didn’t seem to get its 1,200 mile run-in/break-in service. That’s a bit dodgy.
• It seemed to go through quite a number of owners right at the beginning. Though that may be down to it being a lease or I’m misreading the CarFax history.
• There’s quite a large gap in the service history from 13K mi to 25K mi.

[TimmyTurbos]

Pay for a PPI at a BMW dealership. That will tell you mechanically if anything is up with it. If they won't see this through, walk away. I would also advise to not buy from any region with inclimate weather if you can help it.

[MavJ]

It looks like the car was used sparingly initially. Then for a year the person put on 20k km as a daily driver which would include all winter - salt is an issue and if the car is stored inside, rust can happen quicker than being left outside all winter. Still, the overall mileage is reasonable for the age of the car. To me, a Canadian, seems like $54k USD is a lot for this car, but prices differ in Canada from the US.

I lived in Montreal for many years and tracked at Tremblant and Calabogie (Quebec and Ontario).

[Burrcold]

I wouldn't trust any car coming from Quebec, unless it's new and straight from a dealer (regardless of whether it comes with a CarFax).

[Little Brave]

I appreciate the feedback everyone! Seems like its unanimous to move on from this one. Really liked the option that the car has a full PPF already. However, it seems there is just to many unknowns without a proper PPI.

[thebmw]

Originally Posted by TimmyTurbos

I would also advise to not buy from any region with inclimate weather if you can help it.

True, but that's even more important when the car comes from hot weather like Arizona, Texas, Florida, etc. For some reason, people falsely think that cars from this region are preferred. The hot weather and super dry and super humid conditions, demolishes leather, plastics, gaskets, and rubber. The intense sun ruins paint, clear coat, and causes color fade.

On newer cars, rust is not an issue unless you bathe the car in salt and never wash it. Any responsible owner who goes to a halfway decent car wash that has under spray capabilities will wash that salt off.

[Phillies8008]

"Unless" and "responsible owner" is doing a lot of heavy lifting here. Unfortunately, you have no idea if the former owner, much less multiple owners, much, much less someone who was leasing did any of these things. I think it's safer to assume the worst than hope for the best.

[Alfisti]

Quebec is known as a hot spot for rolling back odometers.

[thebmw]

Originally Posted by Phillies8008

"Unless" and "responsible owner" is doing a lot of heavy lifting here. Unfortunately, you have no idea if the former owner, much less multiple owners, much, much less someone who was leasing did any of these things. I think it's safer to assume the worst than hope for the best.

True for all cars, especially M cars. It is fascinating how many of them have been beat on without proper break-in or warm up. Multiple owner car implies that each one just wanted to have fun for a few thousand miles before flipping it.

I still think the hot weather cars are the worst. Driven year round in toxic weather for cars.

[Phillies8008]

Originally Posted by thebmw

True for all cars, especially M cars. It is fascinating how many of them have been beat on without proper break-in or warm up. Multiple owner car implies that each one just wanted to have fun for a few thousand miles before flipping it.

I still think the hot weather cars are the worst. Driven year round in toxic weather for cars.

Yeah, I think a lot of them get leased and the owner figures it ain't his problem after year three, so YOLO it is. I imagine the quick-flipper guy is going to be about the same. I would be very careful in picking a used M car were I looking to buy one.

[Little Brave]

Switching focus to looking at this M2C out in California, thoughts based on the carfax?

https://www.carfax.com/vehiclehistor...fyPKCLcEZs6b9g

Also, given that I'm in Maryland, what is your best advice for negotiating a deal out of state, PPI first then negotiate price or just fly out there?

Lastly, what is a fair offer for this vehicle?

[learntocode]

Originally Posted by Little Brave

Switching focus to looking at this M2C out in California, thoughts based on the carfax?

https://www.carfax.com/vehiclehistor...fyPKCLcEZs6b9g

Also, given that I'm in Maryland, what is your best advice for negotiating a deal out of state, PPI first then negotiate price or just fly out there?

Lastly, what is a fair offer for this vehicle?

OTD price $50k

[Phillies8008]

Originally Posted by Little Brave

Switching focus to looking at this M2C out in California, thoughts based on the carfax?

https://www.carfax.com/vehiclehistor...fyPKCLcEZs6b9g

Also, given that I'm in Maryland, what is your best advice for negotiating a deal out of state, PPI first then negotiate price or just fly out there?

Lastly, what is a fair offer for this vehicle?

Definitely get a PPI first at a mechanic that you choose. Don't use their guy – you want someone who isn't dependent upon them for business. And make sure he's at least Euro-specific, though BMW-specific would be best. Once you've flown cross-country you're kind of committed both time-wise and money-wise, so I wouldn't buy a ticket, much less get on the plane, without being sure that the car is mechanically sound and having a firm deal settled. It's going to be tough and expensive to buy a last-minute ticket and get back on a plane bound for home if you have to pull the plug on the whole thing because the numbers weren't what you thought they were or whatever.

You could also just have the car trucked to you. It'll cost a couple grand, but once you figure in the plane ticket, gas, food, etc. it's probably at least break even compared to going to get it yourself. Of course then you're buying it a bit sight unseen, but you could also do a detailed Zoom walk around with him. Just depends on how confident you feel, I guess.

[kach0w]

I'd stay away from Quebec cars, accidents aren't required to show up on CarFax. CarFax even warns of this too

[Little Brave]

Originally Posted by Phillies8008

Definitely get a PPI first at a mechanic that you choose. Don't use their guy – you want someone who isn't dependent upon them for business. And make sure he's at least Euro-specific, though BMW-specific would be best. Once you've flown cross-country you're kind of committed both time-wise and money-wise, so I wouldn't buy a ticket, much less get on the plane, without being sure that the car is mechanically sound and having a firm deal settled. It's going to be tough and expensive to buy a last-minute ticket and get back on a plane bound for home if you have to pull the plug on the whole thing because the numbers weren't what you thought they were or whatever.

You could also just have the car trucked to you. It'll cost a couple grand, but once you figure in the plane ticket, gas, food, etc. it's probably at least break even compared to going to get it yourself. Of course then you're buying it a bit sight unseen, but you could also do a detailed Zoom walk around with him. Just depends on how confident you feel, I guess.

Appreciate the thorough advice. Definitely good points to keep in mind.

[jefe2000]

Originally Posted by Little Brave

Switching focus to looking at this M2C out in California, thoughts based on the carfax?

https://www.carfax.com/vehiclehistor...fyPKCLcEZs6b9g

This one’s service history looks much more standard. Proper break-in service around 1,200 miles, oil changed once a year (roughly every 10K mi, sometimes as long as 12K miles between oil changes, which is a bit too infrequent IMO), spark plugs changed before 30K miles.

[RockCrusher]

Originally Posted by Little Brave

Switching focus to looking at this M2C out in California, thoughts based on the carfax?

https://www.carfax.com/vehiclehistor...fyPKCLcEZs6b9g

Also, given that I'm in Maryland, what is your best advice for negotiating a deal out of state, PPI first then negotiate price or just fly out there?

Lastly, what is a fair offer for this vehicle?

I'm always leery of any used vehicle servicing done by an off brand seller. Off brand being in this case a Honda dealer servicing/selling a BMW.

Unless the dealer could provide me with a service invoice showing what fluids/filters/etc were used my concern would be just whatever the service department had handy (0w-20 oil) and auto parts store non OE filters were used.

I've bought several new cars long distance, long distance being 90 miles (my 1st MINI JCW), 200 miles (a 2023 M2!), and 873 miles (a 2nd MINI JCW).

Well, negotiated and agreed upon all the purchase details like price, in some cases what my trade in was worth, how I would pay, in the case of the M2 there was a $2500 pre-payment asked for which I agreed to and which I put on my AMEX card for whatever "protection" that afforded me, that I would *not* pay sales tax on the car. (I believe I dodged paying sales tax because I was paying cash for the vehicle. FWIW I've been told that if a vehicle is leased/financed sales tax must be collected. I have not attempted to verify this.)

To my mild surprise all purchases went without a hitch. But these were with new cars.

I have heard/read horror stories about long distance car purchases and especially used car purchases that were well, horror stories.

While I will shop globally I much prefer to buy locally. Locally being close enough I can go kick the tires and light the fires. (My last used car purchase a 2003 996 Turbo I ended up buying this at a Porsche dealer around 40 miles away. I was at that dealer's lot -- *after* hours -- more than once to check out the car look it over before I showed up and sat down with a salesman to buy the car.)

Given you are in Baltimore I have to believe there are a number of M2s for sale in that area. Even if none meet your approval one that will should turn up.

As for what is a fair offer fair has nothing to do with the price of a used (or new) car.

My SOP has been to with a used vehicle to visit www.kbb.com and www.nada.com and plug in the car's details and see what the wholesale/trade in, private sale, and retail sale prices are.

My initial offer is around the trade in value as it is my understanding this is close to what the seller has invested in the car.

But if you are negotiating long distance some negotiation techniques will be less effective or even not really available to you.

[Phillies8008]

Originally Posted by RockCrusher

I'm always leery of any used vehicle servicing done by an off brand seller. Off brand being in this case a Honda dealer servicing/selling a BMW.

Unless the dealer could provide me with a service invoice showing what fluids/filters/etc were used my concern would be just whatever the service department had handy (0w-20 oil) and auto parts store non OE filters were used.

I've bought several new cars long distance, long distance being 90 miles (my 1st MINI JCW), 200 miles (a 2023 M2!), and 873 miles (a 2nd MINI JCW).

Well, negotiated and agreed upon all the purchase details like price, in some cases what my trade in was worth, how I would pay, in the case of the M2 there was a $2500 pre-payment asked for which I agreed to and which I put on my AMEX card for whatever "protection" that afforded me, that I would *not* pay sales tax on the car. (I believe I dodged paying sales tax because I was paying cash for the vehicle. FWIW I've been told that if a vehicle is leased/financed sales tax must be collected. I have not attempted to verify this.)

To my mild surprise all purchases went without a hitch. But these were with new cars.

I have heard/read horror stories about long distance car purchases and especially used car purchases that were well, horror stories.

While I will shop globally I much prefer to buy locally. Locally being close enough I can go kick the tires and light the fires. (My last used car purchase a 2003 996 Turbo I ended up buying this at a Porsche dealer around 40 miles away. I was at that dealer's lot -- *after* hours -- more than once to check out the car look it over before I showed up and sat down with a salesman to buy the car.)

Given you are in Baltimore I have to believe there are a number of M2s for sale in that area. Even if none meet your approval one that will should turn up.

As for what is a fair offer fair has nothing to do with the price of a used (or new) car.

My SOP has been to with a used vehicle to visit www.kbb.com and www.nada.com and plug in the car's details and see what the wholesale/trade in, private sale, and retail sale prices are.

My initial offer is around the trade in value as it is my understanding this is close to what the seller has invested in the car.

But if you are negotiating long distance some negotiation techniques will be less effective or even not really available to you.

FWIW, I've bought at least four cars that were long distances away, ranging from ~100 miles to ~800, and never had a problem. But two of these had return policies, and the other two were fairly inexpensive so the risk was somewhat mitigated. I'd just make sure that there's an out if everything isn't as it was promised to be once you get there and would be hesitant to put too much of a non-refundable deposit on it.

[Murf the Surf]

Originally Posted by Alfisti

Quebec is known as a hot spot for rolling back odometers.

If there is shady business to be done in Canada Quebec and Montreal are the hot spots in Canada. Regardless of the business being done.

[Altamate]

Originally Posted by Alfisti

Quebec is known as a hot spot for rolling back odometers.

Can you even roll back the odometer on a modern BMW? And then you have a carfax history to clean up?