[MKSixer]

Originally Posted by Not_Judy

I did deal with this once about 2 years after our divorce. She had some p.o.s. that she went on a date with on a Friday night and when I dropped my boys off at their mothers on Sunday he was moved in with her.

A few weeks later the ex-wife had bought an inflatable pool. My boys and his daughter were all playing in the pool. My youngest son who is incredibly soft-hearted apparently splashed his daughter in the face and she started crying. This soon to be struggling for his life piece of shit, held my sons head under the water and started yelling at him.

When I showed up to pick up my boys, the youngest was still crying. He explained to me what happened before we left her house. I instantly went to the door and rang the bell. She answered the door and he refused to come to the front of the house; he was hiding out back. After me explaining to her that if he ever touched my child again, I'd hold his head under the water. I then acted like I was leaving and walked around the side of the house and took him by surprise. Grabbed him by his throat and shoved him up against the wall. Leaned in close to his hear and spoke very quietly and sternly and said, "If you ever touch my child again, no one will ever find your body." It took everything I had not to completely wreck his shit. The only reason I didn't is because his daughter was there and my boys were watching.

By the time I dropped my kids off on Sunday he had moved out.

Father of the Year.
Well done, sir. Well done.

[MKSixer]

Never_Enough Kyngofpop here is why I have the talk.

Time: Last night.
Place: High end steakhouse.

The president of a company on whose board I sit came into town and wanted to have a quick sit down to get my opinion on a few which transpired at a meeting he had a few hours prior to us getting together. Nothing formal...just 2 guys talking in a bar. I knew how long it would take and asked my friend to meet us around 9:45-10:00 PM for a late drink. The prez and I finished, she rolls in, says hi and he departs.

We then move to the bar and sit to grab our drinks and chat. We ended up talking to about 4 or 5 other patrons in our area with one actually working in my industry and had lively, pleasant conversation. About an hour into in and as we're watching sports center, I rise to go to the head, do my business and come back. She's very close mouthed and her mood, once jubilant and happy is now reserved. She then asks if we can break after we finish the drink. I say sure and we go to a late night coffee house. After we arrive and sit down she said, "that sonofabitch hit on me and asked me what someone that looks like me is doing with that N-word." She didn't want to make a scene and chose not to tell me in the moment. This was a guy that I hit it off with, or so I thought, and had actually exchanged phone numbers as we have friends in common in my industry.

This crap still happens and I will take my own counsel on this topic.

Cheers gentlemen - mk

[________]

Originally Posted by MKSixer

Never_Enough Kyngofpop here is why I have the talk.

Time: Last night.
Place: High end steakhouse.

The president of a company on whose board I sit came into town and wanted to have a quick sit down to get my opinion on a few which transpired at a meeting he had a few hours prior to us getting together. Nothing formal...just 2 guys talking in a bar. I knew how long it would take and asked my friend to meet us around 9:45-10:00 PM for a late drink. The prez and I finished, she rolls in, says hi and he departs.

We then move to the bar and sit to grab our drinks and chat. We ended up talking to about 4 or 5 other patrons in our area with one actually working in my industry and had lively, pleasant conversation. About an hour into in and as we're watching sports center, I rise to go to the head, do my business and come back. She's very close mouthed and her mood, once jubilant and happy is now reserved. She then asks if we can break after we finish the drink. I say sure and we go to a late night coffee house. After we arrive and sit down she said, "that sonofabitch hit on me and asked me what someone that looks like me is doing with that N-word." She didn't want to make a scene and chose not to tell me in the moment. This was a guy that I hit it off with, or so I thought, and had actually exchanged phone numbers as we have friends in common in my industry.

This crap still happens and I will take my own counsel on this topic.

Cheers gentlemen - mk

You didn't make much sense, with all due respect (I've been a long time lurker and have you in very high regard, as I do many others here).

The guy was an asshole.
Your skin colour has nothing to do with it.
You "having the talk" wouldn't have changed the scenario above in the slightest.

Insert any other adjective where the N word was placed (whitey, fat, loser, bald, short, sweaty, short-dicked, poor, rich ass, snob, white trash, plebe, stuck up, etc you get the gist).

I fail to see how "the talk" would've changed the outcome of your otherwise pleasant evening (I can perhaps see how having had the talk could have made that evening maybe less pleasant all around, as your date could've come defensive expecting the worst as per your "talk").

Do you see how it could've helped your scenario?

[MKSixer]

Originally Posted by OnerDriver

You didn't make much sense, with all due respect (I've been a long time lurker and have you in very high regard, as I do many others here).

The guy was an asshole.
Your skin colour has nothing to do with it.
You "having the talk" wouldn't have changed the scenario above in the slightest.

Insert any other adjective where the N word was placed (whitey, fat, loser, bald, short, sweaty, short-dicked, poor, rich ass, snob, white trash, plebe, stuck up, etc you get the gist).

I fail to see how "the talk" would've changed the outcome of your otherwise pleasant evening (I can perhaps see how having had the talk could have made that evening maybe less pleasant all around, as your date could've come defensive expecting the worst as per your "talk").

Do you see how it could've helped your scenario?

I find this quite interesting as my friend told me that she didn't believe things like this still happened until she started dating me. Is it confirmation bias or just increased situational awareness?

There were quite a few words he could have used to describe me but he went to that place. Why would he do that? If you can give me a satisfactory answer when I'm wearing a 1500 suit and I'm clearly intelligent based on our conversation. He could have simply state, "Hey, I'm sure he's a nice guy but if you ever get tired of him, hit me up...here's my number". I know this because it happens. Guys have hit on her before and I don't mind paying what I call the, "pretty girl tax". Guys hit on hot women. If you don't like it, don't date a hot woman. He chose to use a racially charged word. His choice. Nothing to do with me besides my phenotype.

What is the excuse for this? I'm asking quite seriously.

[________]

Originally Posted by MKSixer

I find this quite interesting as my friend told me that she didn't believe things like this still happened until she started dating me. Is it confirmation bias or just increased situational awareness?

There were quite a few words he could have used to describe me but he went to that place. Why would he do that? If you can give me a satisfactory answer when I'm wearing a 1500 suit and I'm clearly intelligent based on our conversation. He could have simply state, "Hey, I'm sure he's a nice guy but if you ever get tired of him, hit me up...here's my number". I know this because it happens. Guys have hit on her before and I don't mind paying what I call the, "pretty girl tax". Guys hit on hot women. If you don't like it, don't date a hot woman. He chose to use a racially charged word. His choice. Nothing to do with me besides my phenotype.

What is the excuse for this? I'm asking quite seriously.

Again, low hanging fruit.
The asshole would've used any other excuse (say you showed up in a Ford pinto and he was driving a Ferrari, he would've used that).

The fact people are racist or appear racist wouldn't change with the talk, would it? That was the question I posed.

So if you're "poor" and only date "rich" girls, would you have the talk with them then? To prevent them from being surprised when hit on by other assholes in bars saying "what are you doing with this loser, I have a Ferrari" when you go to the washroom?

[DETRoadster]

Originally Posted by MKSixer

Never_Enough Kyngofpop here is why I have the talk.

Time: Last night.
Place: High end steakhouse.

The president of a company on whose board I sit came into town and wanted to have a quick sit down to get my opinion on a few which transpired at a meeting he had a few hours prior to us getting together. Nothing formal...just 2 guys talking in a bar. I knew how long it would take and asked my friend to meet us around 9:45-10:00 PM for a late drink. The prez and I finished, she rolls in, says hi and he departs.

We then move to the bar and sit to grab our drinks and chat. We ended up talking to about 4 or 5 other patrons in our area with one actually working in my industry and had lively, pleasant conversation. About an hour into in and as we're watching sports center, I rise to go to the head, do my business and come back. She's very close mouthed and her mood, once jubilant and happy is now reserved. She then asks if we can break after we finish the drink. I say sure and we go to a late night coffee house. After we arrive and sit down she said, "that sonofabitch hit on me and asked me what someone that looks like me is doing with that N-word." She didn't want to make a scene and chose not to tell me in the moment. This was a guy that I hit it off with, or so I thought, and had actually exchanged phone numbers as we have friends in common in my industry.

This crap still happens and I will take my own counsel on this topic.

Cheers gentlemen - mk

You know what upsets me most about this? The fact that you are so calm and rational in how you handled the situation and describe it here in your post. It tells me this is about the 10 millionth time you've had to deal with this sort of thing and that's just so sad and wrong.

What baffles me is that the guy gave you his number and given your mutual friends it's no mystery to you who he is or how to find him. Then he has the balls (stupidity?) to use that term with your lady friend, who obviously doesn't share those views. In what way does that situation work out for that guy?

If you need a 15 yard dump truck of steaming manure ordered up to his house, just hit me up. Happy to help.

[MKSixer]

Originally Posted by OnerDriver

Again, low hanging fruit.
The asshole would've used any other excuse (say you showed up in a Ford pinto and he was driving a Ferrari, he would've used that).

The fact people are racist or appear racist wouldn't change with the talk, would it? That was the question I posed.

So if you're "poor" and only date "rich" girls, would you have the talk with them then? To prevent them from being surprised when hit on by other assholes in bars saying "what are you doing with this loser, I have a Ferrari" when you go to the washroom?

Thanks for finding an excuse to justify his behavior. Even in light of actual evidence your post shows that you seem to believe there is no actual evidence of racism. I'm baffled by this.

Are you familiar with the aphorism, "Forewarned is Forearmed"? This is a way I conduct my life and attempt to provide every eventuality that I can for those whom I spend time with. As I've stated before, I had a good friend who left the area because of this type of ugliness towards he and his wife at first and his kids later. What is the reason for the ugliness directed towards he and his wife? Are they very sensitive and misunderstanding or does this type of racism actually exist?

I'm saddened by the excuses seemingly given to deflect/excuse this BS. As I said before, by gf didn't believe that this didn't exist and had her world turned upside down the first time it happened. This isn't the first time, only the latest.

I'd actually like answers to the two aforementioned questions.
Cheers-mk

[MKSixer]

Originally Posted by DETRoadster

You know what upsets me most about this? The fact that you are so calm and rational in how you handled the situation and describe it here in your post. It tells me this is about the 10 millionth time you've had to deal with this sort of thing and that's just so sad and wrong.

What baffles me is that the guy gave you his number and given your mutual friends it's no mystery to you who he is or how to find him. Then he has the balls (stupidity?) to use that term with your lady friend, who obviously doesn't share those views. In what way does that situation work out for that guy?

If you need a 15 yard dump truck of steaming manure ordered up to his house, just hit me up. Happy to help.

Thanks. He was pretty tipsy and gave him my number before the entire sordid mess occurred. I also have his. He's been banned from the restaurant. The bartender told the management team and he was done.

Cheers-mk

[________]

Originally Posted by MKSixer

Thanks for finding an excuse to justify his behavior. Even in light of actual evidence your post shows that you seem to believe there is no actual evidence of racism. I'm baffled by this.

Are you familiar with the aphorism, "Forewarned is Forearmed"? This is a way I conduct my life and attempt to provide every eventuality that I can for those whom I spend time with. As I've stated before, I had a good friend who left the area because of this type of ugliness towards he and his wife at first and his kids later. What is the reason for the ugliness directed towards he and his wife? Are they very sensitive and misunderstanding or does this type of racism actually exist?

I'm saddened by the excuses seemingly given to deflect/excuse this BS. As I said before, by gf didn't believe that this didn't exist and had her world turned upside down the first time it happened. This isn't the first time, only the latest.

I'd actually like answers to the two aforementioned questions.
Cheers-mk

Maybe you're a little emotional so I'll let you recover your rational capacity.

Attacking me is not the way to go.
I have not justified any behaviour. I actually asked you a question many times and you haven't answered it.

But it's ok, perhaps the whole question is rhetorical anyway at this point.

Cheers and sorry if I offended you with a question. Wasn't the intention. And maybe read less into what someone thinks or believes, as you implied I think what the guy did is not racism or "justified".

[DETRoadster]

Originally Posted by MKSixer

Thanks. He was pretty tipsy and gave me his number before the entire sordid mess occurred. I also have his. He's been banned from the restaurant. The bartender told the management team and he was done.

Cheers-mk

Situation handled with complete and total class. Not one bit surprised given what I know of your character.

[MKSixer]

Originally Posted by OnerDriver

Maybe you're a little emotional so I'll let you recover your rational capacity.

Attacking me is not the way to go.
I have not justified any behaviour. I actually asked you a question many times and you haven't answered it.

But it's ok, perhaps the whole question is rhetorical anyway at this point.

Cheers and sorry if I offended you with a question. Wasn't the intention. And maybe read less into what someone thinks or believes, as you implied I think what the guy did is not racism or "justified".

I'm not at all emotional. This is no wild screed. I'm asking you to answer 4 simple questions. Directly. Can you do so? I'd greatly appreciate it.

You said that it was low hanging fruit and I countered that there was another way to hit on my gf without moving in that direction. People have hit on her without resorting to racist statements. Please take a look at the questions in my previous posts and provide an answer, if you choose to. I'd sincerely like to know how you rationalize this information.

Cheers-mk

[MKSixer]

Originally Posted by DETRoadster

Situation handled with complete and total class. Not one bit surprised given what I know of your character.

It's the only way once you reach a certain age. I'm not going to change some clown who's been on the planet longer than I have about who I am. And a bar fight is such a cliche!!

Cheers, my friend-mk

[________]

Originally Posted by MKSixer

I'm not at all emotional. This is no wild screed. I'm asking you to answer 4 simple questions. Directly. Can you do so? I'd greatly appreciate it.

You said that it was low hanging fruit and I countered that there was another way to hit on my gf without moving in that direction. People have hit on her without resorting to racist statements. Please take a look at the questions in my previous posts and provide an answer, if you choose to. I'd sincerely like to know how you rationalize this information.

Cheers-mk

Not entirely sure what the 4 questions are, sorry. If you could help me structure them I would most certainly answer them right away. But I did ask 1 first, and you didn't answer it, correct? Not going to get hung on the fact that "I asked first", I would like to answer yours too.

Maybe you're missing my point. My point is, there's racism in the world, as there is bigotry and other bad things.
My question was, how is it that having "the talk" would help your case. I namely suggested the "poor/rich" scenario as a metaphor for the fact that your date is fully aware of who/what you are.
Having the talk about the obvious does not help what others will do.
If it would, how so? (That is THE question).

If she's going out with you, and is aware of who you are (black, white, poor, rich, thin, fat, bald, hairy) and is an adult, she will be able to make the decision herself and handle it on her own, surely?

That's my point. Not for racism, not justifying it, not lessening the importance of it.

[MKSixer]

Originally Posted by OnerDriver

Not entirely sure what the 4 questions are, sorry. If you could help me structure them I would most certainly answer them right away. But I did ask 1 first, and you didn't answer it, correct? Not going to get hung on the fact that "I asked first", I would like to answer yours too.

Maybe you're missing my point. My point is, there's racism in the world, as there is bigotry and other bad things.
My question was, how is it that having "the talk" would help your case. I namely suggested the "poor/rich" scenario as a metaphor for the fact that your date is fully aware of who/what you are.
Having the talk about the obvious does not help what others will do.
If it would, how so? (That is THE question).

If she's going out with you, and is aware of who you are (black, white, poor, rich, thin, fat, bald, hairy) and is an adult, she will be able to make the decision herself and handle it on her own, surely?

That's my point. Not for racism, not justifying it, not lessening the importance of it.

I believe that I did answer your question: Forewarned is Forearmed. My friend stated that she couldn't believe this behavior didn't exist until it was in her face. She also told me that she was glad that we discussed prior to it happening the first time. At a very nice party.

That is my point.

Cheers-mk

[________]

Originally Posted by MKSixer

I believe that I did answer your question: Forewarned is Forearmed. My friend stated that she couldn't believe this behavior didn't exist until it was in her face. She also told me that she was glad that we discussed prior to it happening the first time. At a very nice party.

That is my point.

Cheers-mk

But how did that help the situation?

[Turkish Pickle]

Originally Posted by Never_Enough

Must be one of these "open relationship" sluts. That seems to be the new fad now. Hard pass on those gems.

hard pass for a relationship yes, if they're in an "open relationship" i feel bad for the guy but then again i don't really. the mere suggestion of that to me is just a call to break up, there's some stuff i can put up with but being cucked is not one

besides at that point what really is the point of a relationship?

[MKSixer]

Originally Posted by OnerDriver

But how did that help the situation?

Do you believe in road signs in areas where there may be anomalistic dangers such as falling rocks or the potential for washouts in case of flash floods?

The theory is the same.

She was made aware of a situation may occur and was more clearly able to deal with it when it did. We've been out dozens of times in many different situations and it's occurred 2x. She was better able to manage the situation having been warned that it may happen. I was a Boy Scout.

Cheers-mk

[________]

Originally Posted by MKSixer

Do you believe in road signs in areas where there may be anomalistic dangers such as falling rocks or the potential for washouts in case of flash floods?

The theory is the same.

She was made aware of a situation may occur and was more clearly able to deal with it when it did. We've been out dozens of times in many different situations and it's occurred 2x. She was better able to manage the situation having been warned that it may happen. I was a Boy Scout.

Cheers-mk

That makes sense. Thanks. I'm skeptical about the effectiveness/downsides ratio of this approach as one cannot test both of them in the same scenarios (same people, same circumstances) so it's hard to say which would yield the best benefits. So I'll give it to you as you clearly have more experience in these, UNFORTUNATELY.

Now what questions didn't I answer my man? I'm sorry if I appear to not have answered them. I am enjoying the conversation and clarity we're all gaining from different perspectives here.

Cheers

[MKSixer]

Originally Posted by OnerDriver

That makes sense. Thanks. I'm skeptical about the effectiveness/downsides ratio of this approach as one cannot test both of them in the same scenarios (same people, same circumstances) so it's hard to say which would yield the best benefits. So I'll give it to you as you clearly have more experience in these, UNFORTUNATELY.

Now what questions didn't I answer my man? I'm sorry if I appear to not have answered them. I am enjoying the conversation and clarity we're all gaining from different perspectives here.

Cheers

Excellent. And thanks for your understanding. I appreciate your approach and requirement for rigor with respect to this issue.

Questions with context. The first two.
As I've stated before, I had a good friend who left the area because of this type of ugliness towards he and his wife at first and his kids later.

What is the reason for the ugliness directed towards he and his wife?

Are they very sensitive and misunderstanding or does this type of racism actually exist?

[MKSixer]

OnerDriver

Second set of questions, totaling 5 not 4 in context and highlighted. Sorry about the miscount and thanks for diving into this. I believe we may be the ultimate thread jackers.

Thread jack to sociological discussion.

Cheers-mk

Originally Posted by MKSixer

I find this quite interesting as my friend told me that she didn't believe things like this still happened until she started dating me. Is it confirmation bias or just increased situational awareness?

There were quite a few words he could have used to describe me but he went to that place. Why would he do that? If you can give me a satisfactory answer when I'm wearing a 1500 suit and I'm clearly intelligent based on our conversation. He could have simply state, "Hey, I'm sure he's a nice guy but if you ever get tired of him, hit me up...here's my number". I know this because it happens. Guys have hit on her before and I don't mind paying what I call the, "pretty girl tax". Guys hit on hot women. If you don't like it, don't date a hot woman. He chose to use a racially charged word. His choice. Nothing to do with me besides my phenotype.

What is the excuse for this? I'm asking quite seriously.

[________]

Originally Posted by MKSixer

Excellent. And thanks for your understanding. I appreciate your approach and requirement for rigor with respect to this issue.

Questions with context. The first two.
As I've stated before, I had a good friend who left the area because of this type of ugliness towards he and his wife at first and his kids later.

What is the reason for the ugliness directed towards he and his wife?

Are they very sensitive and misunderstanding or does this type of racism actually exist?

The reason is racism/bigotry. We're not arguing, I hope, that racism does exist. They're not sensitive or misunderstand.

My point was to identify if "the talk" would be beneficial in pre-empting some adult going in a scenario they're well aware of. I believe you made the point of elucidating to many that racism/bigotry exist.

I gave the examples of "poor/rich" not to justify any actions/behaviours, but rather to use them as metaphors for how pre-empting someone to something they, as adults, are already aware and do not care. Call it "naïvety", but sometimes I believe not being aware of the ugliness of the world is helpful.
e.g.: "what are you doing with this N, when you could be with a guy like me?" - "If you have to ask that question, you wouldn't understand what kind of person he is and why I am with him" as in "I do not care what you think of him, I like him for who he is", and case closed.

You contend that not being aware could be a potential blow and the person could not have all resources to deal with it immediately. I respect that.

I used a personal experience when I was the one pre-empted, and I did not feel particularly well-cared for (as in, I would prefer if the person herself had been naïve and not "self-aware" of the fact that, in hers and other people's eyes, I was the "different" one). Call me a dreamer. I like that expression that says that racism exists because we keep talking about it (in a sense of, nobody is different as we're all humans).

So if you would call that guy an "asshole" had he said to her "what are you doing with this poor guy, when I can give you all the jewelry you want", why can't you because he used your skin colour as reason for her not to be with you and to be with him?
The "low hanging fruit" sentence was to say that we, as humans, use whatever it is we find "detrimental" about someone else to influence others. He, as an asshole in this case, would've used any other "aspect" of you to influence her to screw him. It could be that you have a big nose, or are short, anything about you you cannot change, like your skin colour. Point was, how she would react to that in that scenario with or without being "warned".

[________]

Originally Posted by MKSixer

OnerDriver

Second set of questions, totaling 5 not 4 in context and highlighted. Sorry about the miscount and thanks for diving into this. I believe we may be the ultimate thread jackers.

Thread jack to sociological discussion.

Cheers-mk

I find this quite interesting as my friend told me that she didn't believe things like this still happened until she started dating me. Is it confirmation bias or just increased situational awareness?

I think you are definitely more aware of these situations as you experience them first-hand. My previous post talks about some "naïvety" that exists, and is confirmed by your date lack of awareness in this case.

There were quite a few words he could have used to describe me but he went to that place. Why would he do that? He's racist.

If you can give me a satisfactory answer when I'm wearing a 1500 suit and I'm clearly intelligent based on our conversation. He could have simply state, "Hey, I'm sure he's a nice guy but if you ever get tired of him, hit me up...here's my number". I know this because it happens. Guys have hit on her before and I don't mind paying what I call the, "pretty girl tax". Guys hit on hot women. If you don't like it, don't date a hot woman. He chose to use a racially charged word. His choice. Nothing to do with me besides my phenotype.

What is the excuse for this? There's no excuse. And many people think like him but do not convey the message with the same choice of words. He is racist and not ashamed of it (or drunk enough to let his inner thoughts out).

Again: we're not arguing that racism exists... Unfortunately it does, and I think it always will. If not "black or white", it is with some other form that humans create to create dissent and live in silos.