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      07-30-2019, 01:23 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cfm56d7b View Post
BMW Group is clearly regrouping but just like any large corporation driven by quarterly earnings it's a reactionary response to a crisis which had been brewing for a while.

Report card:

- EV strategy and execution: F. If GM can take apart Honda Accord in the 90s to learn why buyers prefer it over Chevy Malibu, so can BMW with its competitors.

- Simplifying product portfolio: B. X1 ought to be retired in favor of X2. Keeping 8 series Gran Coupe is a prudent decision. Four doors appeal to more buyers. 3 series GT was a poorly conceived model.
Except the X1 sells very well in China, I believe its actually the best selling BMW SUV globally
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      07-30-2019, 01:23 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by am3r1ka View Post
X8 new niché market?
Somebody has to go after the Lamborghini Urus..

https://www.lamborghini.com/en-en/models/urus
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      07-30-2019, 01:25 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mo@BMWofFairfax View Post
"In addition to the three-door 1 Series, 2 Series Gran Tourer, and 3 Series GT, tombstones are being chiseled for the 2 Series convertible, standard-wheelbase 7 Series, Z4 replacement (sorry, Toyota), and both two-door 8 Series variants. If it wasn’t Reithofer’s personal darling, the 6 Series GT would also be head straight to the slaughterhouse in 2024. The 8 Series Gran Coupe will likely survive alongside the long-wheelbase 7 Series. While the X2 is also said to live on borrowed time, BMW has finally signed off the brand-new X8 which is mercifully not just a coupe version of the gargantuan X7. Instead, the board gave a green light to an emphatically sporty crossover which will be exclusively offered in M Performance and X8 M forms, and also sport a brawny M Power plug-in-hybrid powertrain that incorporates a 168-hp, 184-lb-ft electric motor and 60-kWh battery pack for zero-emissions driving range of up to 60 miles."
Who wants any of these cars anyway? The 1 series HB is cool looking but we never got this. The 2 series GT looks terrible, and...we never got this either. The 3 series GT is also horrible looking and a terrible idea all the way around. Never been a fan of convertibles, so IMO, get rid of them all. Should I care that there's only going to the a LWB 7-series? I currently don't. The Z4 has been going downhill since the first generation, so again, no tears will be shed here. The 8 series. Mixed feelings here. It's a really slick looking car in some way, but when I see them at the dealer, they look like a German Buick Riviera. They're just too big, IMO. No manual doesn't help.

I'm not seeing anything on the list that bothers my enthusiast sensibilities. IMO, if BMW keeps offering the M2/3/4 in a manual version I will have no problems with the brand. I don't care what SUVs they add or what other cars they stop producing. I don't care what they do with Mini or RR either.
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      07-30-2019, 01:26 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arcades View Post
Z4 has always been a odd car I think. It doesn't sell very well and it doesn't fit with BMW demographics. They only brought it back because of Toyota and the partnership.

I would be suspicious if they kill the Z4 early since Supra is important to Toyota.

By the way, I have seen more X2 on the road than the X1 lately. Why kill off the X2? Then just released the 8 series, and is already planning on killing the coupe but says hey the X8 is good to go!!! :
I've shockingly seen more X2's for sale as used vehicles at CarMax and Dealerships as well as loaner vehicles, than actual X2's that are owned by customers. :
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      07-30-2019, 01:41 PM   #27
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BMW needs to get 25% lower emission as a group and it's having difficulty making money for car cost less than 40k euro

BMW still sell like 2+ million vehicle, so unless down size, can't be niche player, really worry about their future with its electrical vehicle so far behind...
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      07-30-2019, 01:49 PM   #28
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What a trooper the Z4 is. Sacrificing herself to take out the 2AT and 3GT. May future generations remember her name
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      07-30-2019, 02:15 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by New2Roundel View Post
I'm not seeing anything on the list that bothers my enthusiast sensibilities. IMO, if BMW keeps offering the M2/3/4 in a manual version I will have no problems with the brand. I don't care what SUVs they add or what other cars they stop producing.
Well if they don't sell a lot of SUVs they will not have the profits to build M2/3/4 cars. Those aren't the high volume cars, and they will die off without SUV sells. It's already happened to Ford. Sedans are gone, and Mustang is holding on, helped by heritage.

Even Porsche has this problem. They sell more SUVs than sportscars and they need the SUVs to sell well to be able to support the small number of 911s they design. Most popular Porsche is Cayenne and Mecan SUVs and 911/Boxster distant third/fourth place.
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      07-30-2019, 02:30 PM   #30
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So basically they don't know what they're doing. Great. But making an X8 is the STUPIDEST IDEA EVER!
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      07-30-2019, 02:36 PM   #31
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Damn! The 8 Series didn't last long at all. I guess BMW thought it would be a success, but it's proving to fail based on their expectations.
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      07-30-2019, 02:37 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tag View Post
This is what happens when you have too many damn models in your lineup.
I agree 100%!
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      07-30-2019, 02:40 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phoenixbmwlife View Post
I am happy the 8 series GC will stay though but wow lots of changes and geez Donald Trump is again directly responsible for changes made to global companies. I do not like the idea of one man having this much power.
That's nothing. Any POTUS can pretty much destroy the entire world with nuclear weapons.
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      07-30-2019, 03:13 PM   #34
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Too bad, the 8 series coupe is beautiful.
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      07-30-2019, 03:23 PM   #35
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      07-30-2019, 03:48 PM   #36
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Guess is all numbers for BMW.
Porsche indeed is the star now.
I don't believe cheap bmws 1,3 don't bring profits. They bring biggest profits by the numbers they sell. Something is not write here.
3 is the iconic bmw car...or at least it was up to crappie f30.
3GT - v good family car. Space, economic, with 4wd is great. Problem is lack of noise insulation.
Z4 - I like all of them.
Of course they should sell the 2 series fwd and SUV in high numbers. These keep the development of m cars.
One trick I would like is to get rid of m340, m550 and any other non m car with m badge on it. For me all the non m with m badge kill the real thing.
Good lock to them.
I lost count how many series they make
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      07-30-2019, 03:54 PM   #37
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Like others have mentioned, really shocked at eliminating the 8 series coupe / convertible. Test drove on this past weekend and really liked what it had to offer. It is a very capable GT car. Not sure why they're keeping the 8 grand coupe if they think the rest will die.

Also eliminating the standard wheelbase 7 series? That's another bummer, but guess 7 was always bought by the limo companies.

In terms of going back to their performance DNA, is the focus just on the M3/M4? Maybe not even the M2 anymore?
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      07-30-2019, 03:57 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joshuastein55 View Post
I've shockingly seen more X2's for sale as used vehicles at CarMax and Dealerships as well as loaner vehicles, than actual X2's that are owned by customers. :
My sister has one and loves it. Skinny seats and all.
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      07-30-2019, 04:00 PM   #39
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Automobile: What's Going on at BMW? Many Future/Current Cars Are Being Axed

Bmw needs to eliminate a shit ton of models.

Oh man they said the new M3 will have a "louder aesthetic"

Hopefully not that ugly ass grill
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      07-30-2019, 04:08 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by New2Roundel View Post
Who wants any of these cars anyway? The 1 series HB is cool looking but we never got this. The 2 series GT looks terrible, and...we never got this either. The 3 series GT is also horrible looking and a terrible idea all the way around. Never been a fan of convertibles, so IMO, get rid of them all. Should I care that there's only going to the a LWB 7-series? I currently don't. The Z4 has been going downhill since the first generation, so again, no tears will be shed here. The 8 series. Mixed feelings here. It's a really slick looking car in some way, but when I see them at the dealer, they look like a German Buick Riviera. They're just too big, IMO. No manual doesn't help.

I'm not seeing anything on the list that bothers my enthusiast sensibilities. IMO, if BMW keeps offering the M2/3/4 in a manual version I will have no problems with the brand. I don't care what SUVs they add or what other cars they stop producing. I don't care what they do with Mini or RR either.
This is pretty much my sentiment too - keep putting 6MT in the M2/M3/M4 and I'm set.

However, BMW seriously has needed consolidation in the lineup for years. Do we really need coupe SUVs, M Performance cars and switching out the coupes and convertibles into even numbered models? I think it should be something like this:

1 (120i/130i/M1)
3 (330i/340i/M3 Sedan/Coupe/Convertible)
5 (530/540i/550i M5 Sedan/Coupe/Convertible)
7 (740i LWB, 750i, LWB)
X1 (30i)
X3 (30i, 40i, X3 M)
X5 (40i, 50i, X5 M)
X7 (40i, 50i)
Z4 (30i, 40i, M)
i3
i8
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      07-30-2019, 04:21 PM   #41
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good decision on BMW's part. the so called entry-lvl luxury compact sedan and SUV market won't bring any meaningful margins. it's a race to the bottom, a competition of which OEM can come up with the best "civic" of their lineup and fool college grads into thinking they are getting a legit german badge on budget. except poor college grads will skip directly to the civic and rich ones jump to a model 3.
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      07-30-2019, 05:21 PM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ecaedus View Post
good decision on BMW's part. the so called entry-lvl luxury compact sedan and SUV market won't bring any meaningful margins. it's a race to the bottom, a competition of which OEM can come up with the best "civic" of their lineup and fool college grads into thinking they are getting a legit german badge on budget. except poor college grads will skip directly to the civic and rich ones jump to a model 3.
Or those college grads will skip both of them and just call Uber or Lift, or use a ride share app.

A good friend of mine just gave her car to her grandfather, and never looked back.

According to her it's not worth owning a car in the city.

A major sign of the times ahead.
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      07-30-2019, 05:43 PM   #43
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In fact, since 2015, BMW share prices in Europe have fallen from €122 ($137) to €65 ($73)—a decrease of 47 percent. Last year, earnings of the car division tumbled by 22 percent to €6.2 billion ($7 billion), while the return on Finvestment fell from 9.2 to 7.2 percent. For this year, the first official estimate warned of a possible further decline to between 4.5 and 6.5 percent.

No way, but BMW told me in 2012 that the driver's car was out, and soft was IN for the Chinese market.

Seems to be working out.
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      07-30-2019, 06:13 PM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by secretanchitman View Post
This is pretty much my sentiment too - keep putting 6MT in the M2/M3/M4 and I'm set.

However, BMW seriously has needed consolidation in the lineup for years. Do we really need coupe SUVs, M Performance cars and switching out the coupes and convertibles into even numbered models? I think it should be something like this:

1 (120i/130i/M1)
3 (330i/340i/M3 Sedan/Coupe/Convertible)
5 (530/540i/550i M5 Sedan/Coupe/Convertible)
7 (740i LWB, 750i, LWB)
X1 (30i)
X3 (30i, 40i, X3 M)
X5 (40i, 50i, X5 M)
X7 (40i, 50i)
Z4 (30i, 40i, M)
i3
i8
Next BMW CEO right here
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