BMW 1-Series Forum (F20) 135i - 1Addicts.com > Second Generation 1 Series Forum > 2012 BMW 1-Series Sporthatch (F20) Discussion > Rumor: BMW Mulling 1 Series Sedan M Model to Take on CLA45 AMG and S3 Sedan
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      11-28-2012, 11:18 AM   #23
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I love that render...
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      11-28-2012, 11:21 AM   #24
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This is just full of WIN!!! I hope for a 280-300hp turbo 4 connected to a manual 6 speed on a RWD car that weights 3200lbs with 50/50 weight distribution is pure BMW.
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      11-28-2012, 11:26 AM   #25
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Originally Posted by doublevanosrc View Post
This is just full of WIN!!! I hope for a 280-300hp turbo 4 connected to a manual 6 speed on a RWD car that weights 3200lbs with 50/50 weight distribution is pure BMW.
I do agree, that sounds nearly ideal. Ideal would be a few hundred pounds lighter, but BMW isn't exactly known for light cars. I can't get excited about any current or near sedan, the F30 is too large for my tastes, the ATS isn't significantly smaller and unproven, the IS is a mess and the replacement is doing a good job of hiding and the new A3 sedan is still Haldex. So I'd buy an F2x sedan in a second, provided I don't have to drive it in reverse to enjoy it.
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      11-28-2012, 11:26 AM   #26
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Originally Posted by jphughan View Post
Don't hold your breath. Even M engines that are based on regular series counterparts (which in the past was most of them, actually) were reworked substantially to safely produce that much power before being put into an M car. It's not just a matter of adjusting boost and a few maps.
it was for the 1M
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      11-28-2012, 11:31 AM   #27
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I don't quite get it. Scott26 never mentioned a RWD sedan on the current platform. Instead he mentioned a FWD sedan of the next generation 1-Series and a RWD 2-Series Gran Coupe. Which platform this will be based on? And what is the point to arrive around 2015 since in theory there will also be a 2-Series Gran Coupe M AND a FWD 1-Series sedan? Confusing stuff.
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      11-28-2012, 11:33 AM   #28
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Great news. This is a much needed niche to be filled.
.
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      11-28-2012, 11:34 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doublevanosrc
This is just full of WIN!!! I hope for a 280-300hp turbo 4 connected to a manual 6 speed on a RWD car that weights 3200lbs with 50/50 weight distribution is pure BMW.
id be surprised if they get the weight down that much, even m3s and e8Xs are fairly heavy now a days. It would be a ton of fun around town if they can deliver 300bhp in a light rwd sedan.
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      11-28-2012, 11:37 AM   #30
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Originally Posted by e92door3 View Post
high hp 4 cylinder sounds nice but i would still preffer a turbo 6 under the bonnet i mean let's be honest bmw makes the sweetest 6 cyl engines.
I'm with you. Was checking out new 328i 4-cylinders last night on YouTube with exhaust work and it just sounds so, blah.

I love the sound of my N55 with the Berk muffler but the 4 banger isn't doing anything for me.
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      11-28-2012, 11:37 AM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doublevanosrc View Post
This is just full of WIN!!! I hope for a 280-300hp turbo 4 connected to a manual 6 speed on a RWD car that weights 3200lbs with 50/50 weight distribution is pure BMW.
This is a winning forumla, and they would sell out a limited production run. Now if they could, through the use of lightweight materials and reduced complexity come up with the same formula with a car weighing 2800 lbs., they would have a game changer: one that would be on the cover of every magazine, be seen at every autocross, and top every 10 best list the world over.
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      11-28-2012, 11:40 AM   #32
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good idea //M - keep'em coming!
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      11-28-2012, 11:56 AM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Nice View Post
it was for the 1M
The 1M's engine:

- Only adds a paltry 5 hp compared to the stock N54 fitted to the Z4 35is (even basic aftermarket tunes for the N54 make more than the stock 1M's power)

- Isn't a true M-developed engine, evidenced by the fact that its engine code is N54, not S something. Like most of the car, it's a parts bin raid of other vehicles. It's still an outstanding finished product, but that doesn't change its underpinnings.

I doubt BMW will get 300hp out of the N20 with nothing but a tune. Sure, aftermarket tuners may pull it off, but they don't have the same breadth of concerns that BMW does in terms of warranty, longevity, operating environments, dealing with customers who don't properly maintain their car and then want BMW to foot the bill for repair, etc.

Take a look at the differences between the M50/S50, M52/S52, and M54/S54 engines, or even the N63/S63 engines in the FI camp to see what I'm talking about. M doesn't make an M engine by adjusting a tune and calling it a day.
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      11-28-2012, 11:56 AM   #34
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I like it
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      11-28-2012, 12:11 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jphughan View Post
Take a look at the differences between the M50/S50, M52/S52, and M54/S54 engines, or even the N63/S63 engines in the FI camp to see what I'm talking about. M doesn't make an M engine by adjusting a tune and calling it a day.
Are you trying to argue that the S63 isn't easily tuned? If anything, the switch to FI on S series engines is making tuning potential much easier and cheaper than on the previous n/a motors.
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      11-28-2012, 12:13 PM   #36
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The render looks awesome!

What I really like about this, is that it will effectively become what the 3 series used to be. It needs to be RWD though.

I think the biggest problem for this car is that both the Audi S3 sedan and Mercedes CLA45 AMG will hit the market late next year as a 2014 model. This one might be too late for the party.
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      11-28-2012, 12:22 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Faust View Post
I don't quite get it. Scott26 never mentioned a RWD sedan on the current platform. Instead he mentioned a FWD sedan of the next generation 1-Series and a RWD 2-Series Gran Coupe. Which platform this will be based on? And what is the point to arrive around 2015 since in theory there will also be a 2-Series Gran Coupe M AND a FWD 1-Series sedan? Confusing stuff.

The Gran Coupe is the four door 2er.
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      11-28-2012, 12:25 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Faust View Post
I don't quite get it. Scott26 never mentioned a RWD sedan on the current platform. Instead he mentioned a FWD sedan of the next generation 1-Series and a RWD 2-Series Gran Coupe. Which platform this will be based on? And what is the point to arrive around 2015 since in theory there will also be a 2-Series Gran Coupe M AND a FWD 1-Series sedan? Confusing stuff.
I could've sworn that Scott26 mentioned a M2 Grand Coupe as the competitor for the CLA45AMG and S3...

I was always under the impression that BMW was considering using the 2 series as the basis for the sub 3er four door since it would utilize RWD. I really can't see BMW developing a FWD ///M car. That just doesn't make sense.
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      11-28-2012, 12:28 PM   #39
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I thought they were doing a FWD 1-Series Sedan AND a RWD 2-Series Gran Coupe.
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      11-28-2012, 12:34 PM   #40
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The render looks pretty good. I thought they were thinking of creating an M2 Gran Coupe to compete with the upcoming CLA45 AMG and S3 sedan though. Does this mean there will be a 1 series sedan and a 2 series Gran Coupe? I'm also still looking forward to see the 2 series/M2 coupe and the rumored Z3.
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      11-28-2012, 12:34 PM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jphughan View Post
Don't hold your breath. Even M engines that are based on regular series counterparts (which in the past was most of them, actually) were reworked substantially to safely produce that much power before being put into an M car. It's not just a matter of adjusting boost and a few maps.
that was true in past, but is not any more.
There has been no rework on the N54 engine going into the 1series M coupe.
In fact there was really only a map adjustment and more boost.(i dont count an upgraded FMIC as an engine upgrade) A little more work has gone to the new m5, but also there its not as much as it was in past lets say for the e46 M3.
Increased diplacement, other pistons, different ignition system, higher redline, different fuel preparaton system... finally only the base block is shared somehow.
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      11-28-2012, 12:44 PM   #42
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I like it but why not market the M135i here first??
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      11-28-2012, 12:51 PM   #43
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I like it but why not market the M135i here first??
This. It would be incredible to get the car over here, it really sounds like a fantastic car to drive based on the reviews. I can only hope that BMW will not release any variant of an M car that is driven by the front wheels, it would be a terribly disappointing move. I (and I would wager many others as well) would much rather pay a premium and have a rwd car rather than getting a fwd car that torque steers and has poor driving dynamics. There is no fun in driving a fwd car.
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      11-28-2012, 12:51 PM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SCOTT26 View Post
The Gran Coupe is the four door 2er.
Exactly, which in theory will be the competition for a S/RS3 Sedan and CLA 45 AMG. Where exactly a 1-Series M sedan (especially if it is based on FWD platform) would fit? Unless the 2-Series Gran Coupe is priced well above its two main competitors. In that case a 1-Series M sedan would make sense.
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