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      06-02-2019, 07:10 PM   #67
Sy1616
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Originally Posted by zx10guy View Post
Umm....he didn't quote your post. It was the below he was addressing....
Oops, you’re right! I apologize!
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      06-02-2019, 07:31 PM   #68
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Originally Posted by aftercompletion View Post
The reality for motorcycles is that, for significant time savings in traffic, you need to be taking on large amounts of risk that are actually much higher than things that people traditionally think are risky (like going fast on backroad twisties), and which are really only mitigated by being a very attentive and experienced rider.

As a beginner this will take years to achieve, and even then, as others have mentioned, you will need to be white-knuckle attentive at all times during your commute just to avoid hazards that would kill a beginner, and even then there are unavoidable hazards. I think you'll find the stress isn't worth the 20 extra minutes you save.

"I want to spend less time in traffic" is, overall, a flawed motivation for starting to ride.
Agreed. Much too high of a risk for such a little reward.
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      06-02-2019, 07:37 PM   #69
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Their race huh? Interesting.....
Yup.
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Last edited by Efthreeoh; 06-03-2019 at 05:40 AM..
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      06-02-2019, 09:12 PM   #70
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if your commute is 17 miles, consider an electric smart car or an electric motorcycle. i personally wouldn't want to ride a bike in california, let alone learn- too many idiots on their phones.
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      06-03-2019, 06:44 AM   #71
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Originally Posted by zx10guy View Post
Except when I had a flat rear tire. A couple of riders on cruisers (as I was out with my sport bike) just blew by me without even a look. It was obvious I had broken down. Add to this it was 90+ degrees out and I had no shade and had full leathers...which I did take off. The only people that stopped were people in cages. One actually drove to the gas station and came back with a cold bottled water.

And yes, I've stopped before when I saw a fellow rider stopped off the side of the road.

Lol, didn't say all the time or mentioned the ridiculous divide among HD riders and sportbike riders. Douchebags in all categories.
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      06-03-2019, 10:59 AM   #72
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Lots of information to consider here. I'm definitely leaning towards a scooter or one of the small 300cc bikes to start, but this is all pending my taking a riding and safety course. I'll see how I feel then, this will be far from a spontaneous decision. Thanks everyone.
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      06-03-2019, 11:39 AM   #73
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Originally Posted by Efthreeoh View Post
OP, if your commute is just 17 miles, go buy a Zero electric motorcycle, they have a few different models. That's the best choice. Fast recharge time, no engine maintenance. No vibration. Probably a tax incentive too in California.
While a very appealing option I would honestly be nervous driving a motorcycle that was dead silent, seems much more dangerous if other drivers don't hear you at all
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      06-03-2019, 12:34 PM   #74
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While a very appealing option I would honestly be nervous driving a motorcycle that was dead silent, seems much more dangerous if other drivers don't hear you at all
Doesn't matter if you have loud pipes or not. Idiot drivers will be idiot drivers. My Ducati 848 is not a quiet bike. I have a set of Akra slip ons on that bike. Harley riders turn their heads when I ride by. Even that wasn't enough to prevent some idiot from changing lanes into my lane. I wasn't even in their blind spot. I was side by side of them. Had the idiot even checked their mirrors they would have seen me out the side window.
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      06-03-2019, 12:58 PM   #75
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While a very appealing option I would honestly be nervous driving a motorcycle that was dead silent, seems much more dangerous if other drivers don't hear you at all
I've never owned a loud motorcycle. All of mine have had EPA-certified exhaust systems. All loud motorcycles do is annoy other people, and make them not like, and worst off, disrespect motorcyclists. All they do is give the rider hearing loss. Have you ever thought that hearing skidding auto tires may actually warn you of approaching danger?
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      06-06-2019, 03:16 PM   #76
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Originally Posted by Efthreeoh View Post
I've never owned a loud motorcycle. All of mine have had EPA-certified exhaust systems. All loud motorcycles do is annoy other people, and make them not like, and worst off, disrespect motorcyclists. All they do is give the rider hearing loss. Have you ever thought that hearing skidding auto tires may actually warn you of approaching danger?
Actually, if I hear a louder motorcycle coming or splitting lanes towards my direction I'm more cautious and try to scoot over to give the rider extra room. It also deters me from switching lanes at that time.
I'm sure other drivers do/would do the same for you whether you realized it with a louder motorcycle or not.
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      06-06-2019, 04:49 PM   #77
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Originally Posted by das_m2 View Post
Op, all these husbands, fathers and 'significant time saver large risk taking people' opinion givers aren't riders.
Before the moderators savaged this subject, there was multiple messages from riders about just that. The opinion may be divided among actual riders, but I will not be so sure it is divided the way you think. I commute on a bike every day rain-or-shine and I would not ride everyday in heavy congested highway traffic. That's just not a good statistic. Maybe I'm wrong, but that's absolutely not a 'stupid cager' opinion.
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      06-07-2019, 02:58 AM   #78
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Stupid cager here. The simple number is that you're increasing your per-mile risk by TWENTY-EIGHT times. You can multiply this out, and add your risk and cost of injury, to get your absolute risk per year, and with 6,500 motorcycle commuting miles, it's pretty high (I roughly got +1/2,000 risk of dying per year). For purely utilitarian purposes it doesn't really make sense - most people who ride are going to so at least because they enjoy it and it gives a deep, visceral thrill that makes the risk worth it. Zipping around traffic in hot SoCal weather for still upwards of 40 minutes to get home a little earlier seems like a worse tradeoff.

You might also find that you don't save as much time as you expect - you're aiming to cut down your time by 50% in the evening commute. That's going to be very difficult, since you really shouldn't be lane splitting at more than a 10MPH differential. I would guess probably closer to 30% time savings with reasonable risk taking. Perhaps some actual LA riders can chime in

I will say if you've wanted to learn to ride for a while and are still serious about this, go ahead - getting the motorcycle endorsement is fun and teaches you a lot (and taught me that I don't want to commute that way!)

https://www.iihs.org/topics/fatality...ycles-and-atvs
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      06-07-2019, 08:52 AM   #79
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Originally Posted by mlev View Post
Actually, if I hear a louder motorcycle coming or splitting lanes towards my direction I'm more cautious and try to scoot over to give the rider extra room. It also deters me from switching lanes at that time.
I'm sure other drivers do/would do the same for you whether you realized it with a louder motorcycle or not.
I said before that the traffic culture in California is different than other areas of the country. I find loud motorcycles and car/trucks annoying and I'm a gearhead car geek, so I figure most people find them annoying as well. When you spend 20 hours a week commuting in a vehicle, noise becomes a psychological issue. Good-sounding Harley Davidson v-twins are very pleasing. LOUD Hardley V-twins trigger a response from me that envisions a jamming a piece of 1/2 rebar in the front wheel of the machine to see the rider summersault over the handle bars. That goes for sport bikes too.
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      06-07-2019, 12:42 PM   #80
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Originally Posted by EstorilM240 View Post

You might also find that you don't save as much time as you expect - you're aiming to cut down your time by 50% in the evening commute. That's going to be very difficult, since you really shouldn't be lane splitting at more than a 10MPH differential. I would guess probably closer to 30% time savings with reasonable risk taking.
You also have to account for the time it takes to slip in your gear if we are looking only at time considerations. Realistically, putting on a 2-piece cordura suit, gloves and boots, and storing your 'civilian cloth' in some bag will take you no less than 5 to 7 minutes morning and afternoon and may very well eat the major part of the time saving.
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      06-07-2019, 12:50 PM   #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Meeni View Post
Before the moderators savaged this subject, there was multiple messages from riders about just that. The opinion may be divided among actual riders, but I will not be so sure it is divided the way you think. I commute on a bike every day rain-or-shine and I would not ride everyday in heavy congested highway traffic. That's just not a good statistic. Maybe I'm wrong, but that's absolutely not a 'stupid cager' opinion.
I'm sorry you can't split lanes in Tennessee. Never said they were stupid, just stated they're not riders. If you had the legal ability to split, you'd ride in heavy traffic everyday and see that it's safer than riding directly behind vehicles.
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      06-07-2019, 02:07 PM   #82
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Originally Posted by KenB925 View Post
I think it is more dangerous now then it was when I was riding simply because of the smart phone and people being generally checked out.
Lots of great advice in this thread.

I rode bikes (mostly BMW, and the big ones RT, LT, and GS) for many years and I love it. I hit a deer once, and that really put the fear into me, although I stayed up and didn't crash, I could have died. I did lose a friend a few days after we spent a week riding in the CO mountains, he went up into Montana and hit a car. Totally his fault, but that doesn't help much.

Between my age, knees, wrists, tendonitis, etc. and fear, I gave it up. As Ken mentioned, there is just too much distracted driving now, plus more road rage and more congestion. I rode to work sometimes, and there were times when I really doubted my sanity. It's just too easy to get complacent and lazy about having total awareness of what's going on, and if some fool in a 6000 lb. truck runs you over, you would survive the accident in a car but on a bike we're just going to be scraping you off of the pavement.

Best of luck to you, but really, seriously, I wish you'd just stay in the car.
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      06-07-2019, 03:31 PM   #83
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Originally Posted by Meeni View Post
You also have to account for the time it takes to slip in your gear if we are looking only at time considerations. Realistically, putting on a 2-piece cordura suit, gloves and boots, and storing your 'civilian cloth' in some bag will take you no less than 5 to 7 minutes morning and afternoon and may very well eat the major part of the time saving.
This is one of the reasons I don't ride very often to work. I can ride in the HOV lane of I66 in Northern Virginia. But I need to change twice, unless its a Friday. I soon figured out it didn't save much time riding in the HOV lane and then changing twice. And in the summer, heat and humidity suck in traffic. Okay if you are out on a day ride, but to get into the office and be presentable to clients after a load of exhaust has deposited on you. Nope.
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      06-10-2019, 11:27 AM   #84
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To the OP: Been there, done that. Don't bother.

I'd also like to add that the reason I tried street was because I liked riding dirt bikes so much. Didn't care about time savings or parking, etc.

I rode and raced dirtbikes for a number of years. Liked riding but it was always a hassle to load them up and drive somewhere to use them. About 8 years ago I found a great deal on a used 2001 FZ1 (great bike!) and picked it up. Figured I could ride it on country roads, take it easy and just enjoy the scenery. That summer I put several thousand miles on the FZ1 with no issues. It was fun and I got very comfortable on it. I ended up realizing that the risk to myself and my family/friends wasn't worth it.

There are a lot more nasty motorcycle accidents that you don't hear about. People frequently lose feet, legs, arms, get brain damage, broken backs, paralysis, get run over by other cars, etc. I've met plenty of people with permanent disabilites from stupid stuff on bikes. Some were complete morons but some were just in the wrong place at the wrong time.

Few examples:

One guy was riding on the highway and clipped by a car that didn't see him. He hit the guardrail and his lower leg was severed clean off. Another guy plowed into a mini van when the mini van cut him off to make a turn. Suffered permanent brain damage and can barely walk anymore. Another shattered his pelvis at a beginner HPDE. These are just a few off the top of my head but the list goes on.

I will say when you start riding, you are hyper aware to everything around you. As you get more comfortable, it becomes less "scary" until you have an oh shit moment. Oh shit moments vary from cars cutting you off, drivers making eye contact with you but not processing that you are there, deer jumping out, gravel in corners, cars passing over double yellows in tight corners, etc. In a car if you hit a patch of sand/gravel/oil, the car may slide a bit. With a bike, generally if you lose traction- you are going down hard.

If you have the bug for riding, pick up an enduro style dirt-bike (KTM/Husky/Yamaha) and find a local OHRV trail network. Single track riding is a ton of fun and generally pretty safe. It's mostly low speed 1/2/3 gear riding on tight and techinical trails. Mostly balence and clutch work. I stick to single track trail riding and the occasional MX practice day on my RM250. Way more fun and relaxing IMHO.

Last edited by carguy138; 06-10-2019 at 11:56 AM..
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