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      07-26-2019, 06:50 PM   #45
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Porsche is a benchmark to beat. Let's go BMW
Lol will never happen. Porsche are the kings of the automotive landscape. every car they make is best in class across the board and has been for decade now. BMW gave them a great run for their money in the previous decade and then completely sold out to mass appeal without a silver lining (see: Porsche's dominance in the SUV category for their breadwinners, while using the gains to keep their legacy of making the best sports cars).
Porsche is fortunate in that they're part of VW Group.
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      07-26-2019, 06:56 PM   #46
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Dodge / Ram is top non-premium...I can see that. Wife's Durango is well above the run of the mill SUVs in emotional appeal. But still nowhere near my M2!
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      07-26-2019, 07:31 PM   #47
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Appealing

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Originally Posted by ScreamingChicken View Post
Dodge / Ram is top non-premium...I can see that. Wife's Durango is well above the run of the mill SUVs in emotional appeal. But still nowhere near my M2!
Lets see how BMW are ranked after all their vehicles get the huge oversized grills
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      07-27-2019, 05:57 AM   #48
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As far as I'm concerned, VW Group products being #1 and 4 is even more confusing.

After owning Audi products and dealing with their service/maintenance - let me suggest anyone think twice! You'd think they'd learn from the diesel scandal and to better serve their customers, but they really don't give a crap about their customers. First I thought it was the South Florida dealers, then after dealing with Audi corporate, I realize it's systemic.

Vehicles with published TSB's for problems and the dealers refusing to do the repairs because they repeatedly claim they cannot reproduce the issue. Even with me standing there showing them the issue, and their acknowledgment, yet they continue to refuse. And Audi corporate just as moronic.

Then there's Audi's drivers assistance (cameras, lane change assist, etc.). If your car needs a wheel alignment, the dealer will not do the work unless you agree to have these systems "recalibrated" to a tune of $800. No joke. Morons. Google it, its a real issue for their crappy engineered cars. Or a corporate scam pushed down to dealers.

Even a simple software update requires an act of congress to get them to agree to do under warranty.

My guess is Porsche is no different, or little difference.

Just my 2 cents.
Yes, but Porsche owners can afford to pay up for this crap. They donít even blink at a $500 oil change.
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      07-27-2019, 07:53 AM   #49
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Too bad the salesmen at my local dealership don't realize this. I was in there yesterday. They had a 2-series and a G20 in the showroom. I was all over both cars showing as much interest as possible. I was in the mood to test drive the new G20 for some reason. Not a pique of interest in me. I was dressed in business attire. Started to walk out, past the gaggle of salesmen hanging around like a bunch of taxi drivers. One finally releases I might be interested in a car. He asked if he could help me. I said "Well, finally", so just to fuck with him I asked if he had any 2 or 3-series in stock with a manual transmission...

Thinking about it now, maybe they do realize BMW appeal and expect customers to come to them begging for acceptance... Hopefully you guys at BMW of Fairfax are better at selling cars.
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      07-27-2019, 07:54 AM   #50
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JD Power threads are always an adventure on this site because they invariably become a minefield of ‘well I don’t think that, so that study is bullshit’ comments

Which is human nature, so i’m not criticizing, but please do consider that the whole point of market research is to allow you to make decisions based on data representative of the whole field - not your own or the groupthink of the people around you.

As an ex-market researcher this makes me want to go look closer at Genesis to see what the fuss is all about. I saw their 2018’s at the car show - they look like they took solid aim at Lexus and got 80% of the way there....so i see what their strategy is.
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      07-27-2019, 09:21 AM   #51
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Originally Posted by ///M TOWN View Post
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Originally Posted by Cortexiphan View Post
I would believe it, but how is Genesis number 3? Who does that appeal to as a brand?
It must be the service experience that is impressing these owners.

I've never driven one so I have no idea how good they are.
Not here to defend Genesis (don't own one, own 2 bmw's), but their G70 made C&D's top 10 list. Guess what's not on that list? 3 series.
Where have you been? The 3er hasn't "made it" on their list since 2014, or somewhere there about. Does anyone actually take their list seriously though? If we did, we'd all be driving a g70 instead, with its prominent turbo lag and temperamental transmission (according to recent MT comparison article).
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      07-27-2019, 09:28 AM   #52
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JD power survey strategy, rank your customers 1-5 by 1 being the worst. Ignore 1-2, work with 3 and only send surveys to 4-5
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      07-27-2019, 10:34 AM   #53
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I'm pretty sure Mitsubishi's score is entirely attributable to the introduction and popularity of the Mirage lmao
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      07-27-2019, 12:06 PM   #54
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Surprised to see Mazda so low given the criteria (primarily, emotional attachment and excitement). They make a great car for the price.
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      07-27-2019, 12:15 PM   #55
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The Hyundai/Genesis disparity is interesting! I've had one experience with a Hyundai rental and it was pretty bad. But I hear so many good things about the Genesis lineup.
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      07-27-2019, 03:22 PM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 6ixSpd View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by uniqueMR View Post
Porsche is a benchmark to beat. Let's go BMW
Lol will never happen. Porsche are the kings of the automotive landscape. every car they make is best in class across the board and has been for decade now. BMW gave them a great run for their money in the previous decade and then completely sold out to mass appeal without a silver lining (see: Porsche's dominance in the SUV category for their breadwinners, while using the gains to keep their legacy of making the best sports cars).
You're so right.
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      07-28-2019, 07:19 PM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adc View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by claykin View Post
As far as I'm concerned, VW Group products being #1 and 4 is even more confusing.

After owning Audi products and dealing with their service/maintenance - let me suggest anyone think twice! You'd think they'd learn from the diesel scandal and to better serve their customers, but they really don't give a crap about their customers. First I thought it was the South Florida dealers, then after dealing with Audi corporate, I realize it's systemic.

Vehicles with published TSB's for problems and the dealers refusing to do the repairs because they repeatedly claim they cannot reproduce the issue. Even with me standing there showing them the issue, and their acknowledgment, yet they continue to refuse. And Audi corporate just as moronic.

Then there's Audi's drivers assistance (cameras, lane change assist, etc.). If your car needs a wheel alignment, the dealer will not do the work unless you agree to have these systems "recalibrated" to a tune of $800. No joke. Morons. Google it, its a real issue for their crappy engineered cars. Or a corporate scam pushed down to dealers.

Even a simple software update requires an act of congress to get them to agree to do under warranty.

My guess is Porsche is no different, or little difference.

Just my 2 cents.
Yes, but Porsche owners can afford to pay up for this crap. They don’t even blink at a $500 oil change.
Lol I don't know about all that. Average 911 cost of oil change ranges between 200-350 on the high end depending on location. Without any specials. At Indy shops it wouldn't be more than 180.
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      07-29-2019, 05:21 AM   #58
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Not surprised. These cars are amazing machines and those who appreciate it will never leave.
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      07-29-2019, 05:36 AM   #59
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The contempt and confusion over the Genesis brand makes me smile.

I'm glad to see the Genesis brand making waves.
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      07-29-2019, 05:43 AM   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by claykin View Post
As far as I'm concerned, VW Group products being #1 and 4 is even more confusing.

After owning Audi products and dealing with their service/maintenance - let me suggest anyone think twice! You'd think they'd learn from the diesel scandal and to better serve their customers, but they really don't give a crap about their customers. First I thought it was the South Florida dealers, then after dealing with Audi corporate, I realize it's systemic.

Vehicles with published TSB's for problems and the dealers refusing to do the repairs because they repeatedly claim they cannot reproduce the issue. Even with me standing there showing them the issue, and their acknowledgment, yet they continue to refuse. And Audi corporate just as moronic.

Then there's Audi's drivers assistance (cameras, lane change assist, etc.). If your car needs a wheel alignment, the dealer will not do the work unless you agree to have these systems "recalibrated" to a tune of $800. No joke. Morons. Google it, its a real issue for their crappy engineered cars. Or a corporate scam pushed down to dealers.

Even a simple software update requires an act of congress to get them to agree to do under warranty.

My guess is Porsche is no different, or little difference.

Just my 2 cents.
Their driving is on the same level as their customer service. My office is 1/2 mile away from Audi's US corporate headquarters, so I encounter a few Audi "HQ"-tagged vehicles a day. Most DC people are self-important, over-indulged ass-hat drivers anyway, but get near an Audi HQ car in a BMW... they become crazy and HATE to get passed by a BMW. It's just so fun
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      07-29-2019, 09:21 AM   #61
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No points for second place.
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      08-01-2019, 06:55 PM   #62
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I’ve never seen anybody drive a genesis they wasn’t a senior citizen in full retirement.
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      08-03-2019, 11:30 PM   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 6ixSpd View Post
Lol will never happen. Porsche are the kings of the automotive landscape. every car they make is best in class across the board and has been for decade now. BMW gave them a great run for their money in the previous decade and then completely sold out to mass appeal without a silver lining (see: Porsche's dominance in the SUV category for their breadwinners, while using the gains to keep their legacy of making the best sports cars).
Absolutely. As much as I love BMWs M coupes and sedans (not X series stuff), Porsche really are in a different league in terms of quality and driving involvement. Always have been.
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      08-06-2019, 09:40 PM   #64
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Porsche sell way less than BMW, Porsche is a better car but cost accordingly as well...
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