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      01-16-2020, 11:39 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alexk1012 View Post
I'm new to the M family. But I gotta be honest. The inclusion of M Performance doesn't really bother me. I don't think in this competitive market that BMW could have afforded to not make more true M models (X3/4) and more appealing M Performance. I'm just happy we have these options at all.
They don't really need to slap M merch on every most-powerful non-true M series, especially the FWD crossovers and hatchbacks. We went from having 340i's and 550i's to M340i's and M550i's.

E92 335is was a more unique car than whatever the M340i is today, an "M Automobile" car which still has got a one-wheel peeler in the back.

M235i - same recipe as the oft-forgotten 135i but now with added badges and an aggressive ///Marketing campaign that's had every single journo comparing it to old M cars and screaming "BMW BACK TO THEIR ROOTS." 135i was just a stock E82 with a big engine with some Brembos and added cooling. M235i was no different.

If you compare a regular 3 Series to an M3, there are so many visible and hidden differences that it truly is worth the M badge and WBS VIN tag.

I mean, you can't fault BMW because Benz be doing the same. I distinctively remember that they had the C 450 AMG Sport which was after one model year renamed to C 43 AMG. And buyers either don't mind this strategy or just love it.
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      01-16-2020, 11:46 AM   #24
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This makes a lot of sense and will help BMW rekindle its driving machine reputation among BMW enthusiasts. Unfortunately, the 335i became a car that tried to please everybody, and became less and less performance oriented. F***n soccer mom types ruined it in the post-E90 world. Now those types can have the non-M labeled cars. As for M Performance vs true M, that's a debate for another time, but suffice to say that a "true M" car is a very different driving experience, sometimes bordering on the crazy. These M Performance cars are the perfect Goldilocks when optioned correctly.
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      01-16-2020, 11:52 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bahn360Photo View Post
as long as it makes bmw develop better real M models who cares how they make money, even if its placing M stickers on everything.

bmw was the last to follow Audi with S line and RS models. where S cars are just like M240 etc. and then AMG got on the bandwagon with c43 amg and such.

people love badges, so being in business of selling cars these companies are selling much more now so good for us. more money for R&D for true M cars. ......and maybe a new designer for m3/4 front grills
BMW is able to develop and come to market with some of the greatest true M cars through sales/profit from all of the lower performance models/lines such as M-performance, M-sport packages, etc. It's business 101. As long as the core M models continue to be badass, let them slap M badges on whatever they like to get the job done. We all know which cars are the true M cars. My 2020 X5 m-sport has more M badges on it than I can count, but as car guys/gals, we all know it's no M car.
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      01-16-2020, 11:53 AM   #26
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While we all have our own personal feelings about what an M-car is and isn't, etc. Our personal feelings don't make a company continue to be successful in an ever changing and more demanding market. Trying running a company and maintaining continued upward growth after you've reached saturation with your product. If you don't change it up to keep existing customers interested while also attracting new customers, you fail.
If you want to point blame on something, ask yourself one thing, did you take advantage of one of those crazy leases that gives people the opportunity to drive a car that is probably too much for the budget? These quick turn around lease programs is a large contributor to the significant increase in vehicle price, production costs and the need to dilute the heritage of M. Consumers want more and want an upgrade from what they had. BMW reached the end of options to keep models "fresh" and the only unexplored territory for upgrades was pilfering the M department's locker room.
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      01-16-2020, 11:54 AM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Luminor513 View Post
BMW is able to develop and come to market with some of the greatest true M cars through sales/profit from all of the lower performance models/lines such as M-performance, M-sport packages, etc. It's business 101. As long as the core M models continue to be badass, let them slap M badges on whatever they like to get the job done. We all know which cars are the true M cars. My 2020 X5 m-sport has more M badges on it than I can count, but as car guys/gals, we all know it's no M car.
my point exactly
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      01-16-2020, 11:54 AM   #28
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Originally Posted by swagon View Post
They don't really need to slap M merch on every most-powerful non-true M series, especially the FWD crossovers and hatchbacks. We went from having 340i's and 550i's to M340i's and M550i's.

E92 335is was a more unique car than whatever the M340i is today, an "M Automobile" car which still has got a one-wheel peeler in the back.

M235i - same recipe as the oft-forgotten 135i but now with added badges and an aggressive ///Marketing campaign that's had every single journo comparing it to old M cars and screaming "BMW BACK TO THEIR ROOTS." 135i had bespoke Brembos and added cooling. M235i was no different.

I mean, you can't fault BMW because Benz be doing the same. I distinctively remember that they had the C 450 AMG Sport which was after one model year renamed to C 43 AMG. And people either don't mind or just love it.
Agree, regarding BMW's "is" moniker on their Series cars of old. It was an understated moniker and indicated the car's character; i.e. an already good Series car, but just a bit better and more fun to drive. Pity that brand approach has been lost, IMO.
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      01-16-2020, 12:11 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yeru View Post
Agree, regarding BMW's "is" moniker on their Series cars of old. It was an understated moniker and indicated the car's character; i.e. an already good Series car, but just a bit better and more fun to drive. Pity that brand approach has been lost, IMO.
Yeah, liked the "is" models, too. I think the E36 318is or 325is were the last non-M to have an LSD from the factory.

Proper understated thing was the 320si E90, though.
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      01-16-2020, 12:13 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swagon View Post

E92 335is was a more unique car than whatever the M340i is today, an "M Automobile" car which still has got a one-wheel peeler in the back.
The M Performance models are a bit more than a simple badge job.

The idea that they are "true" M cars (whatever that means) can be argued to death, but they are more "M" than the old 335 era cars were. For instance the new M340i comes with the M Sport Differential standard. It's also impossible to get a Luxury or Sport line 340.
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      01-16-2020, 12:20 PM   #31
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They or anybody can call the category of cars whatever they want. It won't change the differences between the various cars.

At least this hopefully means they will retire the gaudy "M Performance" verbiage stamped in various places and that god awful star trek the next generation style font.
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      01-16-2020, 12:20 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheoriginalM2 View Post
M Performance models included ! What an irony !
Well C43 AMG is considered and AMG model. So is the S line with Audi. So there is no irony. There is only cynical trolls.
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      01-16-2020, 12:23 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cortexiphan View Post
Well C43 AMG is considered and AMG model. So is the S line with Audi. So there is no irony. There is only cynical trolls.
C43 , S4 , M340 are all performance wannabes , thats the irony , they present those cars as something special from the normal ones !
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      01-16-2020, 12:28 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arashir View Post
At least this hopefully means they will retire the gaudy "M Performance" verbiage stamped in various places and that god awful star trek the next generation style font.
These things may very well remain for BMW's aftermarket performance parts business. It is just the association of the M Performance brand with actual BMW performance vehicles that is (apparently) going away.
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      01-16-2020, 12:36 PM   #35
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From a marketing standpoint I actually think its a very smart move for BMW to add the "M" in front of the higher trim level non-M cars. Your average consumer doesn't think about or realize that the 335i for example is a large upgrade from the base 330 or 328. This will no doubt help push the higher trim cars by separating them a bit from the base cars. Audi has proven this with their "S" cars.
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      01-16-2020, 12:38 PM   #36
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Totally onboard the non WBS hate, but i would assume it is because BMW is able to sell the M Performance cars at a silly markup is why they can still afford to make proper M cars. Same with Porsche and Cayenne and Macan. Lambo and the Urus...
Not everyone is an M idiot like us on here
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      01-16-2020, 12:46 PM   #37
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So Sorry to break my M brothers hearts, my lowly X2 M35i is an M, BMW says so
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      01-16-2020, 12:47 PM   #38
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Originally Posted by Wyndi335I View Post
Good thing we live in America where you can buy a Performance vehicle and piss off M snobs. Capitalism at its best....😂
(a former snob many times over!!)
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      01-16-2020, 01:04 PM   #39
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If your VIN doesn't start with WBS then it's not manufactured by "BMW M GmbH" and is not a full-fledged M car.
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      01-16-2020, 01:21 PM   #40
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To me: if it has an M it *should* have a factory (mechanical) LSD. If you need to ask what is an LSD is then you shouldnít be looking at an M.

But BMW has become a whore and will wear whatever lingerie to get your money..
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      01-16-2020, 01:36 PM   #41
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So what’s funnier, “real” M-car owners complaining about M Performance cars not being real M’s, or M Performance-car owners preemptively complaining about real M-car owners complaining about their cars?
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      01-16-2020, 02:01 PM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drv4fun View Post
To me: if it has an M it *should* have a factory (mechanical) LSD. If you need to ask what is an LSD is then you shouldn't be looking at an M.

But BMW has become a whore and will wear whatever lingerie to get your money..
But the M340i comes with a LSD. Right? Or is there some nuance I'm missing here?
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      01-16-2020, 02:03 PM   #43
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Originally Posted by marvinp View Post
If your VIN doesn't start with WBS then it's not manufactured by "BMW M GmbH" and is not a full-fledged M car.
Did not know that. Fun fact
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      01-16-2020, 02:04 PM   #44
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So Sorry to break my M brothers hearts, my lowly X2 M35i is an M, BMW says so
Your X2 isnít even a real BMW
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