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      02-04-2017, 09:59 PM   #1
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BMW Sticking with Diesels in the United States

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The past 16 months have been something of a stress test, not just for Volkswagen but for the diesel auto market as a whole. Volkswagen’s diesel emissions scandal brought increased EPA scrutiny, resulting in established models from Mercedes-Benz and BMW put on hold and hopes of ever seeing performance diesels such as the Volkswagen GTD and BMW’s awesome new quad-turbo “super diesel” effectively dashed.

With diesel versions of the Mazda CX-5, Chevrolet Equinox, and Ford F-150 all due this year—as well as the return of the Chevrolet Cruze diesel—it would be premature to call diesels dead for the United States. Yet with VW sitting it out, Audi considering diesel only for SUVs, and Mercedes-Benz in the process of reevaluating its product plans, the market is hardly continuing where it left off. So we asked Fritz Steinparzer, BMW’s global head of diesel-engine development, how the diesel turmoil will affect BMW.

To sum up: He’s pragmatically optimistic about diesels’ future in the BMW product mix—although it’s clear that what happens in Europe over the next few years will ultimately drive the technology’s U.S. fate.

Diesels have made up more than 50 percent of new-vehicle sales in Europe in recent years, but a recent study anticipated that diesels will comprise just 9 percent of that market by 2030. That’s partly due to tougher new emissions rules and the cost of meeting them. The baton is expected to be passed from diesel to hybrid and electric models, especially among small cars—and that could impact what we see in the U.S.

We’ll see a continued downward trend in diesel small-car sales globally, Steinparzer admitted. “But in the bigger, heavier cars, from the customer point of view, diesels are still a very robust solution,” he said. In the U.S., it’s far less a matter of meeting technical hurdles than a discussion with the public. “For passenger cars, if there is enough customer demand we will offer it,” Steinparzer said, “because technically, the solution to meet regulatory demands, we have it.”

The EPA and CARB did a lot of additional tests to other manufacturers’ products after the VW issue, according to Steinparzer. “They never had a problem with our cars here [in the U.S.],” he said, emphasizing that he prefers the American approach and its well-defined driving cycles over Europe’s emissions standards, which are based on engine tests and often don’t correlate well to tailpipe emissions. More realistic driving-based emissions testing methods for Europe will commence in September, and a tighter set of limits will go into effect in 2020.

Meeting U.S. Diesel Emissions Regulations Isn’t the Real Issue

In order to make diesels progressively cleaner in the future, better fuels aren’t necessary, according to Steinparzer, because BMW has a toolbox of several strategies available. Those include further improvements to the injection system and combustion process—to drive down raw “engine out” emissions—and/or applying wider exhaust gas recirculation (EGR) strategies that work closer to full load. And because urea-injection systems, which spray a solution into the hot exhaust stream to reduce NOx, work best in a specific temperature range (540 to 930 degrees Fahrenheit), engineers are considering either a post-injection system or an electrically heated catalyst for the exhaust system. BMW diesels are also due to get a new round of updates to their onboard diagnostics, Steinparzer said.

EPA scrutiny led BMW to suspend production of its U.S.-spec diesel models in late 2016. Although those models were cleared after some additional emissions testing and recertified by late summer, it has taken time to bring them back into the mix. BMW 328d models returned to dealerships in October, while X3 xDrive28d models returned in December; fresh stocks of the BMW X5 xDrive35d are arriving in dealerships this month.

That said, there’s some hope in the numbers. To our request about pent-up demand for diesels, BMW pointed to sales of the 3-series family, which were up more than 28 percent in December versus the same month in 2015. Although BMW North America doesn’t break sales down by submodel—and that increase could include more than a few of the 330e iPerformance plug-in hybrid that was also introduced during this same period—we hear a clear message from BMW: Diesels are here to stay, hopefully for a long time.

http://blog.caranddriver.com/bmw-sti...united-states/
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      02-05-2017, 05:16 PM   #2
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good read

diesels will always be present in bigger cars or suvs

very heated topic in the uk now!
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      02-06-2017, 12:37 PM   #3
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Considering that the SUV makers in America (jeep,Chevy,Ford ) are exploring beginning using diesel motors for their fleet then it would be obvious that other manufacturers would also be doing the same
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      02-06-2017, 01:24 PM   #4
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I'm currently in a position to only have one car. I don't really need two cars but one day when I start a family id love to have a diesel daily driver. Why not? Better economy and something about diesels are just cool..
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      02-06-2017, 01:54 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eddien123
I'm currently in a position to only have one car. I don't really need two cars but one day when I start a family id love to have a diesel daily driver. Why not? Better economy and something about diesels are just cool..
Nothing makes me happier than the stock 425lbft of torque on my 335D. Well, other than the opportunity to increase output dramatically via a tune (and other supporting mods). I love my twin turbo diesel so much that I kind of want another one to replace my f80m once the lease is up...
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      02-06-2017, 02:07 PM   #6
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Considering that the SUV makers in America (jeep,Chevy,Ford ) are exploring beginning using diesel motors for their fleet then it would be obvious that other manufacturers would also be doing the same
Except Audi.
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      02-06-2017, 02:08 PM   #7
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Diesels have made up more than 50 percent of new-vehicle sales in Europe in recent years, but a recent study anticipated that diesels will comprise just 9 percent of that market by 2030.
This says quite a bit about the long term prospects for diesel engines, especially in markets like the US where they are already very low volume. Even if the study is off by more than double, that's still not a wringing endorsement for their future.

I don't think I'd write off the possibility of diesel G30 "540d" for the US yet, but I wouldn't bet on it happening either. Looking further out, I would be very surprised if there is ever a diesel G20 3 Series in the US. Diesel X3, X5, and X7 variants perhaps have more life ahead. But with the proliferation of eDrive models throughout the entire product portfolio including SUVs, and soon pure electric models coming including an X3 or X4, diesel's days may be numbered in SUVs as well.
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      02-06-2017, 02:08 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by M3 Adjuster View Post
Considering that the SUV makers in America (jeep,Chevy,Ford ) are exploring beginning using diesel motors for their fleet then it would be obvious that other manufacturers would also be doing the same
Except Audi.
And Porsche....
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      02-06-2017, 02:10 PM   #9
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Quote:
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eddien123
I'm currently in a position to only have one car. I don't really need two cars but one day when I start a family id love to have a diesel daily driver. Why not? Better economy and something about diesels are just cool..
Nothing makes me happier than the stock 425lbft of torque on my 335D. Well, other than the opportunity to increase output dramatically via a tune (and other supporting mods). I love my twin turbo diesel so much that I kind of want another one to replace my f80m once the lease is up...
I'll just leave this here...
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      02-06-2017, 02:20 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ASBSECU E93
Quote:
Originally Posted by The_Wood View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eddien123
I'm currently in a position to only have one car. I don't really need two cars but one day when I start a family id love to have a diesel daily driver. Why not? Better economy and something about diesels are just cool..
Nothing makes me happier than the stock 425lbft of torque on my 335D. Well, other than the opportunity to increase output dramatically via a tune (and other supporting mods). I love my twin turbo diesel so much that I kind of want another one to replace my f80m once the lease is up...
I'll just leave this here...
That's not even its final form
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      02-06-2017, 02:20 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mkoesel View Post
Quote:
Diesels have made up more than 50 percent of new-vehicle sales in Europe in recent years, but a recent study anticipated that diesels will comprise just 9 percent of that market by 2030.
This says quite a bit about the long term prospects for diesel engines, especially in markets like the US where they are already very low volume. Even if the study is off by more than double, that's still not a wringing endorsement for their future.

I don't think I'd write off the possibility of diesel G30 "540d" for the US yet, but I wouldn't bet on it happening either. Looking further out, I would be very surprised if there is ever a diesel G20 3 Series in the US. Diesel X3, X5, and X7 variants perhaps have more life ahead. But with the proliferation of eDrive models throughout the entire product portfolio including SUVs, and soon pure electric models coming including an X3 or X4, diesel's days may be numbered in SUVs as well.
A diesel G20 makes sense, I think. As does a diesel X5.
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      02-06-2017, 02:21 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ASBSECU E93
Quote:
Originally Posted by The_Wood View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eddien123
I'm currently in a position to only have one car. I don't really need two cars but one day when I start a family id love to have a diesel daily driver. Why not? Better economy and something about diesels are just cool..
Nothing makes me happier than the stock 425lbft of torque on my 335D. Well, other than the opportunity to increase output dramatically via a tune (and other supporting mods). I love my twin turbo diesel so much that I kind of want another one to replace my f80m once the lease is up...
I'll just leave this here...
That's not even its final form
I mean, getting 443 ft lbs of torque and getting something like 35+ mpg doesn't hurt either.
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      02-06-2017, 02:31 PM   #13
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Huge diesel fan right here too. Owned an old school '81 MBZ 240d & that was pretty fun. Love the truck sounds! I wish BMW would do a RWD X5. Now that would be cherry. A diesel 3 series is also on my books soon
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      02-06-2017, 05:50 PM   #14
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Huge diesel fan right here too. Owned an old school '81 MBZ 240d & that was pretty fun. Love the truck sounds! I wish BMW would do a RWD X5. Now that would be cherry. A diesel 3 series is also on my books soon
A family member had the old X5 diesel. It got ludicrous gas milage.
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      02-06-2017, 07:21 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ASBSECU E93
Quote:
Originally Posted by The_Wood View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eddien123
I'm currently in a position to only have one car. I don't really need two cars but one day when I start a family id love to have a diesel daily driver. Why not? Better economy and something about diesels are just cool..
Nothing makes me happier than the stock 425lbft of torque on my 335D. Well, other than the opportunity to increase output dramatically via a tune (and other supporting mods). I love my twin turbo diesel so much that I kind of want another one to replace my f80m once the lease is up...
I'll just leave this here...
Almost exactly my goal for future output!
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      02-06-2017, 08:38 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mkoesel
Quote:
Diesels have made up more than 50 percent of new-vehicle sales in Europe in recent years, but a recent study anticipated that diesels will comprise just 9 percent of that market by 2030.
This says quite a bit about the long term prospects for diesel engines, especially in markets like the US where they are already very low volume. Even if the study is off by more than double, that's still not a wringing endorsement for their future.

I don't think I'd write off the possibility of diesel G30 "540d" for the US yet, but I wouldn't bet on it happening either. Looking further out, I would be very surprised if there is ever a diesel G20 3 Series in the US. Diesel X3, X5, and X7 variants perhaps have more life ahead. But with the proliferation of eDrive models throughout the entire product portfolio including SUVs, and soon pure electric models coming including an X3 or X4, diesel's days may be numbered in SUVs as well.
Governments are throwing money at EV like a NBA player in a strip club. That's a big reason why diesel is going away.
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      02-06-2017, 08:40 PM   #17
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Sometimes I miss my 335d, but BMW failed me on numerous occasions with regards to the SCR.
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      02-06-2017, 08:41 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The_Wood View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by ASBSECU E93
Quote:
Originally Posted by The_Wood View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eddien123
I'm currently in a position to only have one car. I don't really need two cars but one day when I start a family id love to have a diesel daily driver. Why not? Better economy and something about diesels are just cool..
Nothing makes me happier than the stock 425lbft of torque on my 335D. Well, other than the opportunity to increase output dramatically via a tune (and other supporting mods). I love my twin turbo diesel so much that I kind of want another one to replace my f80m once the lease is up...
I'll just leave this here...
Almost exactly my goal for future output!
I've got a few additional mods planned, maybe hybrids at some point.

Main goal now is putting that tq to the ground and controlling it.
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      02-06-2017, 08:48 PM   #19
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Governments are throwing money at EV like a NBA player in a strip club. That's a big reason why diesel is going away.
I'm pretty sure that gov subsidies/insentives are going to end quite abruptly

Once the free money goes away and the playing field leveled we will see which or both makes more sense to consumers
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      02-07-2017, 08:55 AM   #20
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I'll also just leave this here... STAGE 4 BPC

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      02-07-2017, 09:13 AM   #21
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I'll also just leave this here... STAGE 4 BPC

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I talked to Tom (Dan?) the other day, and plan on seeing you guys this spring! So excited.
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      02-07-2017, 09:26 AM   #22
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I talked to Tom (Dan?) the other day, and plan on seeing you guys this spring! So excited.
Awesome You most likely talked to Dan, or Bob. We look forward to seeing you as well
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