[Chihuahua]

Originally Posted by fecurtis

Build a 7 seater V8 powered Mini SUV and call it the Mini Irony.

This actually made me LOL.

I had an R50 that I bought new in 2004. It was a fantastic car, I only sold it because my company afforded me a company car that I could use as a DD and the MINI sat in the garage.

MINIs problem is that they are overpriced, there are too many confusing models, and they have suffered from year over year bloat. The MINI ain't so MINI any more, and that kinda sucks.

[greekcs]

X3 did well even though its slated for replacement.

[jpnh]

Originally Posted by Kyle B

This actually made me LOL.

I had an R50 that I bought new in 2004. It was a fantastic car, I only sold it because my company afforded me a company car that I could use as a DD and the MINI sat in the garage.

MINIs problem is that they are overpriced, there are too many confusing models, and they have suffered from year over year bloat. The MINI ain't so MINI any more, and that kinda sucks.

Admittedly I like the MCS hardtop size a lot and would happily buy one as a DD if they were not so damn over priced and suffer from reliability issues

The B48 engine long term may prove to be more reliable but it got a really bad start with the thrust/crank bearing issues requiring a raft of engine replacements...

I can get a brand new corrolla appliance that will go 200k without needing to do much other than oil, fluids and brakes......or I can spend almost 10k more and get a MCS which will be admittedly a lot more fun but will ultimately suffer from reliability issues which is the entire point of a reliable DD in the first place

My brain wants the appliance

My heart wants the MCS

I wish BMW/Mini would get their act together

[Chihuahua]

My R50 was very reliable. I sold it with right around 60K on it. I took it to the dealer twice for my free oil changes, and that was it. Not a single problem with it up until the day I sold it.

The engine was supposedly a european chrysler engine assembled in Brazil of all places. I purposely didn't get the supercharged car; anytime I heard of someone having a problem with their MINI, it was always an S. It's the same reason I went with a 128i instead of the turbo car.

I too wish MINI/BMW would get their act together, especially in terms of long-term reliability. They've basically created a car for the lease market with reliability to match the lease terms.

BMW of all companies should not be having major problems with engines EVER. I mean, the company's middle name is literally MOTOR for christ's sake.

[goj]

Originally Posted by doublevanosrc

I wonder if it's due to the market or Mercedes and Audi??

In terms of BMW it's the natural ebb and flow of the market. BMW has its two highest selling cars the 3 and 5 at or close to the end of life while competition already has new cars out in those classes.

When gauging BMWs success, I would rather look at the total sales of each generation. I'm sure the next gen 3 and 5 will pull BMW back up.

[InsideMan]

Originally Posted by PhoenixWolf

Car sales on the whole were down in 2016 which is weird because the economy has been recovering. 2015 was a worst year for the average American yet they bought more cars. SUV sales are the winner for car manufacturers I suppose fueled (no pun intended) by low gas prices.

As for BMW I wonder what effect the downgraded ultimate maintenance will have on sales this year. I still think it was a bad decision by BMW.

Maintenance had no effect. They found that with the maintenance, brand loyalty was at an all time low.

In 2017, focus will be in loyalty. No more BS CSI scores. Loyalty. Plain and simple.

The production levels are extremely low. NA is not the largest market. BMW knows what they are doing...

[TimeFor]

Do they ever break down the engine variants? How many more people get the smallest engine vs med and largest?

Around LA I always see 550's but that surprises me because when I had my 528 I never once thought it needed more power. I feel like I see a lot more 750's than 740's too. But I'm guessing its probably the other way around with the 3/4 series.

[midwest 340xi 6sp]

Hmmm....

BMW car sales are down while SUV (sav) sales are up.

So tell me again how this is so different than the trend for the rest of the North American automobile industry?

[mkoesel]

Originally Posted by Midwest 535i

So tell me again how this is so different than the trend for the rest of the North American automobile industry?

Well, true, but some other manufacturers managed to keep their sales relatively flat by achieving the proper passenger car and light truck model mix in inventory. Unfortunately, the Spartanburg plant was not able to keep up. But they will rectify this over the next couple years.

Plus, although it'll technically be called a passenger car, the X2 is coming too. I think X1 sales will double in the next five years and X2 will outsell the X4 and X6 combined by its third year.

[Brake_Late]

Originally Posted by jpnh

Mini is taking a beating

Wow. Roadster numbers are staggering

[bavarian19]

Sales slump had to be expected at some point when you keep offering less car for more relative money. I would still be shopping for a 3 if I felt I was getting something a little special for a respectable price. I am still baffled by a $50k mildly optioned 328.

[Wiles]

I have a BMW unicorn, a manual Z4 3.5i

I would love to see the breakout of M sales, and sales of cars with manual trans.

[SakhirM4]

Originally Posted by mkoesel

Well, true, but some other manufacturers managed to keep their sales relatively flat by achieving the proper passenger car and light truck model mix in inventory. Unfortunately, the Spartanburg plant was not able to keep up. But they will rectify this over the next couple years.

Plus, although it'll technically be called a passenger car, the X2 is coming too. I think X1 sales will double in the next five years and X2 will outsell the X4 and X6 combined by its third year.

It is a sad sad world we live in when BMW has become a purveyor of trucks

[KansasWaldo]

Originally Posted by SakhirM4

It is a sad sad world we live in when BMW has become a purveyor of trucks

I'm personally very glad that the X1 is a success as far as NA sales numbers are concerned. While it deviates from what BMW purists want, it's still a great vehicle. I absolutely love my F48 X1, and I also love BMW. I wanted the equivalent of a crossover, but I also wanted a vehicle that has the quality of BMW that I adore. It was a win/win for me, even if the FWD bias of the xDrive28i shakes things up a bit.

My wife, on the other hand, loves the 2 series (non-xDrive) with 6MT. She's always gone for sportier cars, and I go for the SUV or SAV. The fact that we can get both from BMW makes us very happy customers.

As they say, to each their own.

[mkoesel]

Originally Posted by Brake_Late

Wow. Roadster numbers are staggering

Not sure if you are serious, but the roadster and coupe were discontinued over a year ago.

What's staggering to me (as I've mentioned before) are Clubman sales. If only other manufacturers could convince that many people to buy a "wagon" instead of an SUV.

[r20]

I just picked up my new 2017 x5 yesterday. Honestly it's a nice car, but it was a stupid buy. This is my third straight BMW in an all BMW family.

What kind of manufacturer doesn't have captains row second seats with a usable 3rd row. OR makes a luxury SUV without a trailer hitch? I don't want to tow.. I want to put a bike rack on. Or my tailgating box.

SUVs are meant to be used to enjoy outdoors with families... so why build suvs that don't do that?

BMW needs to get their act together. I think even loyalists like me will eventually go away. The ultimate driving machine is "cool"... but it won't be when cars drive themselves and we have an expensive tin box that's useless.

[r20]

Originally Posted by bavarian19

Sales slump had to be expected at some point when you keep offering less car for more relative money. I would still be shopping for a 3 if I felt I was getting something a little special for a respectable price. I am still baffled by a $50k mildly optioned 328.

I couldn't agree with you more. It's disrespectful to us as consumers to charge 900 extra for rear view camera on a 70k car when a 19k accord has a higher quality camera. Especially when it will be legally mandated next year, saves lives, and most other manufacturers offer it standard.

It's a luxury car, many things should be baseline...

Also, BMWs are becoming way to soft. My 328 sport, feels like a wet blanket to drive. While my old 2014 x1 was so much more fun to drive.

What happened to the 3s beefy steering wheel, and having some feel?
I feel like BMW should make their engineers drive old BMWs before they start designing new ones.

[r20]

Originally Posted by bueller

I am not all that surprised, go sit in a C class, at the low end, a Fusion is not a bad car and for less money you get more performance.

Spot on... the C class feels so refined. That wood paneling and circle metal vents exhubrates quality.

That's what BMW needs, just more natural materials... because gauge wise it's all the same.

But fusion though? Nobody here is buying American. We've all been burned by the terrible quality, poor residual value, and uninteresting drive.

[David70]

Originally Posted by SakhirM4

It is a sad sad world we live in when BMW has become a purveyor of trucks

It is what is currently selling, what would you have done, just continue to build slow selling cars? Not much worse than a company that continues to build what they have always built when their customers no longer want these products because of company "values".

Cars are down 14.5% (with the X1 counted as a car and up 92%) and light trucks are up 2.7%. Remove the X1 and the rest of the light trucks and BMW sales went from 230k to 181k, a 21% drop.

I don't think anyone with a financial interest in Porsche (stock holders or employees) wishes they only built sports cars.

[bavarian19]

Originally Posted by jxr006

Spot on... the C class feels so refined. That wood paneling and circle metal vents exhubrates quality.

That's what BMW needs, just more natural materials... because gauge wise it's all the same.

But fusion though? Nobody here is buying American. We've all been burned by the terrible quality, poor residual value, and uninteresting drive.

Uninteresting drive? I would rather drive a V6 FWD Accord than a neutered RWD 320 from a driving dynamics standpoint. I do prefer good handling, but a 200 hp 4 cyl will never put a smile on my face.

[jpnh]

Originally Posted by mkoesel

Not sure if you are serious, but the roadster and coupe were discontinued over a year ago.

What's staggering to me (as I've mentioned before) are Clubman sales. If only other manufacturers could convince that many people to buy a "wagon" instead of an SUV.

Look at VW sportwagon sales in the US.....those things are EVERYWHERE...the demand is there....I just happen to believe that the mini wagon's aesthetics are not particularly desirable to a lot of people.....and I know a number of people who just cant get past the Clubman's "Hurse" rear doors

the Countryman however has a much more pleasant appearance/dimensions

[DDD31]

Originally Posted by bavarian19

Uninteresting drive? I would rather drive a V6 FWD Accord than a neutered RWD 320 from a driving dynamics standpoint. I do prefer good handling, but a 200 hp 4 cyl will never put a smile on my face.

Get ready for an old guy rant....

200 hp not putting a smile on your face??? Back when I first started driving (late 80s), 200 hp would have been considered high performance. My first car (VW Rabbit Diesel) had a whopping 56 hp which could eventually get to 60 mph after a good long downhill run with a tailwind. Granted cars weighed a lot less back then but in some ways they were more fun to drive than the high powered cars today since you could always drive them nearly flat-out all the time without really having to worry about jeopardizing your driver's license.

The 320 can be a lot of fun to drive since you can wring it out more without having to worry about jeopardizing your driver's license. I can't get anywhere near using the full performance of my 550 on our roads with the amount of power it puts down. Don't get me wrong I like powahhhhh as much as the next guy, but I kinda of miss being able to thrash a car without worrying.

Now get off of my lawn....