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      07-08-2013, 09:53 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ovekvam View Post
I would like to know details about the drivetrains as well. I have been doing some Google research on the M135i x-drive, and this is what I found:
Open front differential. Open rear differential. Active center differential with 40:60 torque split, but adjustable from 0:100 to 100:0 in approximately 1/10 second.

Anybody know how the Mercedes is set up?
I thought its very close how Haldex works, similar maxium 50/50, normal situation its FWD, something around 90/10 or 95/5, so adjustable from 95:5 to 50:50, A45 also open diffs. X-drive is definitely more fun to drive and feels more like Rwd car, because it can send more power to rear axle.

Last edited by Tåst; 07-08-2013 at 10:02 AM..
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      07-08-2013, 09:54 AM   #24
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The A45 AMG is "nice for a change" that kind of deal~
These reviews are useless for US buyers because we don't get any hot hatches !
Thanks for the review
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      07-08-2013, 10:00 AM   #25
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sorry BMW, this maybe weird and for the first time, i think i'll pick A45. that thing is just a beauty!
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      07-08-2013, 10:53 AM   #26
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I think this is a very fair and well written review. It clears up every doubt I had about the A45 AMG like its small displacement, big turbo engine (obviously with more lag than desired) combined with obligatory DCT and electromechanic steering. It is a looker from outside and does certain things extremely well for sure but it doesn't seem to be neither a driver's car nor a practical hatch with gusto. In fact, I would sacrifice some power and pace and go for a fully equipped 125d or a 125i 8speed auto with or without xdrive over this mini AMG, let alone M135i.

However, it also reminds me that BMW once again did not go as far as they could and should, they left some things halfdone with the M135i, like a more attractive design which could put it apart. Still the best option against competition but will it continue making sense after VW releases its next Golf R is yet to be seen.
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      07-08-2013, 11:58 AM   #27
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Great review! I wish we got the A45 here in the states as I'm not a fan of the CLA45's looks and proportions. I think if BMW were to release the LCI version of the M135i with looks like the 2 series test cars we've been seeing, the M135 will be much more appealing. I don't doubt the M135 drives great, but I can't get over it's bad looks (IMO)
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      07-08-2013, 01:55 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ovekvam View Post
I would like to know details about the drivetrains as well. I have been doing some Google research on the M135i x-drive, and this is what I found:
Open front differential. Open rear differential. Active center differential with 40:60 torque split, but adjustable from 0:100 to 100:0 in approximately 1/10 second.

Anybody know how the Mercedes is set up?
It's basically front wheel drive, when it runs out of front end grip an electronically-controlled clutch sends power to the rear. This is how most AWD hatchbacks work because their transverse motors and small packaging make it impossible to fit a more serious form of AWD and this is why many of them end up with lots of understeer. The xDrive M135i should theoretically be better since it is based off a RWD platform with a variable center diff, but I've never driven one so I don't know.
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      07-08-2013, 04:12 PM   #29
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Questions:
Is the Merc as plasticy as it appears from the photo of the rear seat area?

Is the M135 about the same in that regard?
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      07-08-2013, 04:21 PM   #30
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wait, so this is different from the CLA AMG?
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      07-08-2013, 04:43 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mdosu View Post
wait, so this is different from the CLA AMG?
Yes, the Mercedes A-Class is a hatchback and the CLA is a 4-door "coupe." We won't be getting the A-Class in the states.
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      07-08-2013, 04:58 PM   #32
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Nice review Tim!

I tried the A45 AMG a couple of weeks ago - I'd specced one up in expectation of it ticking all the boxes BUT unfortunately found it far too firm... maybe I'm getting old, but it was just too lairy for me.

I'd agree that the interior "screen" is totally ridiculous - the base model comes with standard 5" screen with a bloody great thick black plastic border, like the old days with flat screen tellys. Just looks cheapo. To get the 7", which looks dramatically better, you need to spec the £2,500+ COMAND.

I found it quick but to get any enjoyment from you would have to hoon it everywhere! It was only when the revs where bouncing around the limiter that I found the barks and pops from the exhaust became fun.

Also drove the CLS63, ML63, and C63 Estate on the same day! (A good day!!)
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      07-08-2013, 05:44 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Remonster View Post
It's basically front wheel drive, when it runs out of front end grip an electronically-controlled clutch sends power to the rear. This is how most AWD hatchbacks work because their transverse motors and small packaging make it impossible to fit a more serious form of AWD and this is why many of them end up with lots of understeer. The xDrive M135i should theoretically be better since it is based off a RWD platform with a variable center diff, but I've never driven one so I don't know.
Don't really agree... what you state is the theory of a few years ago. The current FWD hot hatch crowd has little to be left undesired.

The A45 proved already several times during track tests it's feather light, nimble, keen to steer in while putting the power to the tarmac without turning power into black smoke. It has nothing left to learn from the M135i to that respect.

The A3 S3 was not lagging either and even the pure FWD GTi Performance earns top scores in all tests. For the latter, I agree it's at least one class down, but it will get AWD to lift it on eye height soon.
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      07-08-2013, 06:00 PM   #34
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Great review, thank you!

I have a CLA45 AMG on order and if we had an M135i available here, things might be different, but I'm certainly looking forward to it.

The dyno charts of the A45 AMG do reveal quite a bit of lag. But I think that's to be expected on a 2.0L I4 pushing 26PSI.
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      07-08-2013, 06:23 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KoenG View Post
Don't really agree... what you state is the theory of a few years ago. The current FWD hot hatch crowd has little to be left undesired.

The A45 proved already several times during track tests it's feather light, nimble, keen to steer in while putting the power to the tarmac without turning power into black smoke. It has nothing left to learn from the M135i to that respect.

The A3 S3 was not lagging either and even the pure FWD GTi Performance earns top scores in all tests. For the latter, I agree it's at least one class down, but it will get AWD to lift it on eye height soon.

I agree. As I understand it, MB is using a Haldex system, which means the car is FWD in non-aggressive driving. However, the response and torque transfer of these Haldex systems has improved markedly since the original Audi 8L S3, hence the good reviews of the A45. I'm not sure what other 'smarts' MB has built into its axle differentials, especially at the front. By all accounts, it's much better than the RS3.


Edit: Here's Chris Harris's review of the A45 for pistonheads, which reveals more about the AWD system

Last edited by ttimbo; 07-08-2013 at 06:26 PM.. Reason: Added link
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      07-08-2013, 10:32 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by E9TOU View Post
Yes, the Mercedes A-Class is a hatchback and the CLA is a 4-door "coupe." We won't be getting the A-Class in the states.
Can anyone explain y hatchback is banned from US market?
and IMO, these are different priced car. 10K difference is a lot. i dont know what the fuzz, there is a clear winner here. well if u like driving of course u know which one

btw cant wait for Chris Harris comparison, teaser:
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      07-09-2013, 12:49 AM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nlpamg View Post
Great review, thank you!

I have a CLA45 AMG on order and if we had an M135i available here, things might be different, but I'm certainly looking forward to it.

The dyno charts of the A45 AMG do reveal quite a bit of lag. But I think that's to be expected on a 2.0L I4 pushing 26PSI.
How can you see the lag from the dyno charts? On the charts I have seen, there is no time scale.
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      07-09-2013, 01:43 AM   #38
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M135i at low revs

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Originally Posted by Hornady View Post
I drove a 335i once and it felt like it had no torque and was all revs and noise. I might test drive a 135i see if its any better but i fear that i am spoilt because of the 330d torque.
No need to worry. With the M135i torque curve the low rev response is very similar to the 330d, but a lot stronger and continuing to almost 7K
And with 8 speed ATM there massive performance available at all revs....
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      07-09-2013, 02:00 AM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SteveC View Post
No need to worry. With the M135i torque curve the low rev response is very similar to the 330d, but a lot stronger and continuing to almost 7K
And with 8 speed ATM there massive performance available at all revs....
The same performance is available at all revs with the manual gearbox.
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      07-09-2013, 03:47 AM   #40
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Originally Posted by SteveC View Post
No need to worry. With the M135i torque curve the low rev response is very similar to the 330d, but a lot stronger and continuing to almost 7K
And with 8 speed ATM there massive performance available at all revs....
Ill have to book in a test drive, im really hoping an LCI update puts some new head lights on the car though. i really dont like the current ones.
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      07-09-2013, 04:33 AM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ttimbo View Post
I agree. As I understand it, MB is using a Haldex system, which means the car is FWD in non-aggressive driving. However, the response and torque transfer of these Haldex systems has improved markedly since the original Audi 8L S3, hence the good reviews of the A45. I'm not sure what other 'smarts' MB has built into its axle differentials, especially at the front. By all accounts, it's much better than the RS3.


Edit: Here's Chris Harris's review of the A45 for pistonheads, which reveals more about the AWD system
THE PISTONHEADS REVIEW BY CHRIS HARRIS


Well, they certainly stuck to their guns. Almost exactly a year ago I watched a heavily disguised A45 AMG fire its way up a Swabian hillside and couldn’t quite believe how loud the exhaust bangs were on each upshift. Several months later I asked the man from AMG whether these would make it into the full production specification, assuming that they would not. He insisted they would.

OK, it's not V8 noise but it is noise, and lots of itGiven the company’s recent track record of vehicular noise, and the quality thereof, I really shouldn’t have ever doubted them. I would like to say that the A45, driven with the automatic gearbox in manual mode and using all the available engine revs, sounds like a racing car. But given the increasingly stringent race-track noise limits in the UK I think that the comparison is unfair. The A45 sounds better than any BTCC machine.
Enter 'that' BMW
It’s probably a good deal faster in a straight line too. With 360hp and 332lb ft pulling 1,555kg it always feels very potent, but the power delivery is something of a surprise. Peak torque arrives at 2,250rpm and plateaus until 5,000rpm, but peak power isn’t produced until 6,000rpm. On the road this equates to vast, low effort performance for overtaking, but leaves a delicious kick at the top end. The way the motor revs beyond 5,000rpm and delivers a decisive extra surge that moves it into a performance category beyond even the RS3 and M135i is unexpected. It’s urgent, free-revving and at those high engine speeds doesn’t feel in any way turbocharged.


It's not AMG as we've known it but it is impressiveThe noise is unspectacular when you’re not trying, but it’s never harsh. Mechanical refinement is good, but you get the feeling that AMG felt the need to allow a low-level fizz to be transmitted from the engine block to the bodyshell. Curiously, and much like the best Honda VTEC installations, the A45’s powertrain is smoother and much more musical further up the rev range.
Against the flow
The gearbox is an all-new AMG developed seven-speed double clutch unit and, like the motor it has been tested to destruction by machine and engineers. AMG always seems to be completely out of sync with the rest of the world when it comes to transmissions. Five years ago when the world was going dotty for dual clutch systems, AMG gave us a seven-speed wet clutch automatic, which was rather impressive. In fact I suspect its robustness and usability in fast cars probably strongly influenced the brilliant new ZF eight-speed auto ‘box which has quickly established itself as the new benchmark over dual-clutch alternatives in everything from luxo-saloons down to the little M135i. So, everyone now wakes up to the possibilities of a fully automatic transmission, whereupon Merc gives us a dual-clutcher.


Downer on paddles? Generally noIt’s a very good effort, not quite the fastest or most incisive ‘box out there, but it is pretty damn good. In auto mode it’s utterly painless and uses the torque curve with great efficiency to help return well over 30mpg when you’re tootling along. I found it a bit frustrating that you could override the auto mode with a quick paddle flick, but couldn’t send it back into auto without fiddling with the mode switch by the gearlever. In other Mercs you just pull the up paddle beyond seventh and it re-selects D. Small point, but it would irritate me over a year’s driving.
Exit the old-school
Perhaps the biggest question hanging over the A45 was the potential contamination of any kind of chassis enjoyment by the evil that is called Haldex. Yes, the same 4WD system that has blighted VW products with understeer lurks under the skin of this car. On the road, the car neither under nor oversteers. It just demolishes anything in its way. The ride is firm, in fact it tippy-toes right on the edge of what is acceptable in town and at low speed, but then it rewards you as you travel faster. The quality of the damping shines through, it remains flat but doesn’t get deflected and the payback for the firmness is an agility that must render the A45 one of the faster point-to-pointers on sale. Certainly, on a mixture of A- and B-roads a C63 wouldn’t see where it had gone. Nor would anything in that class. Torque, traction, grip, dimensions, no deflections, no understeer; the A45 is perhaps the perfect road recipe. And that’s before it rains.


It's a grip monster but does give you optionsOn the track it is miles more fun than an RS3. Provoke it harshly and the rear axle will begin to rotate, but it never feels like it’s rear-wheel drive. It also never feels like, say, a Mitsubishi EVO with its insane turn-in and instant oversteer. But it’s fun and very effective, helped enormously by electric power steering that is bettered only by the new GT3’s system for weight and sense of connection and a truly brilliant brake pedal. Can’t remember the last time I had such confidence in road car brakes.
Doing a number
Some people think the cabin is too chintzy; I don’t. The new electrically adjustable Recaros are superb, the wheel is standard issue AMG, as is the snazzy gear selector. They’ve done a good job covering as much of the ordinary A-Class undergarments as possible, although the hard plastics down by the centre armrest are pretty nasty. And of course the electric handbrake is utterly hateful. Then again, once you’re used to it, the way you can open the driver’s door to trigger the gearbox into Park is a stroke of genius for everyday use. Until you’re accustomed to it, that is – up until this point you might head-butt the steering wheel.


So is it worth the money? Let battle commenceSo it’s great fun to drive, indecently fast, sounds good under duress and is laden with standard equipment – but is it really worth £37,845? Not if you’re making the usual PH comparisons with used M3s and the like. But the world doesn’t always work like that. Factor in a decent finance deal (ducks) or people who just want something discreet, effing fast and untouched by another’s bottom and it doesn’t look too pricey to me.
Box ticking
Of course you can go loopy with the extras list. The car I drive had carbon exterior mirror housings for a mere £1,230. The Comand sat-nav thing is a silly £2,100. Then again, to drag an M135i up to a similar spec as the A45 reduces the price difference considerably. I shall do this when we release the twin-test video in a few weeks.


Even the bling doesn't quite set it apart enoughNo, the lingering impression here is of a car with immense talent and much to offer many people. I just wish AMG had been given free rein to add some wider arches and give the car some more, well, stance. The RS3 is trounced by this car in just about every department of driving dynamics, but Audi knows how to sell cars and those wide arches and suggestive ride height are showroom gold. From the rear three-quarter the A45 does have some menace to it, but in your rear view mirror it is quite innocuous looking. That will endear it to those looking for subtlety, but I suspect they’re in the minority in this marketplace.
Otherwise, I thought the A45 was mostly brilliant.

Video with the M135i soon, promise!

MERCEDES-BENZ A45 AMG
Engine: 1,991cc 4-cyl turbo
Transmission: 7-speed dual clutch auto, four-wheel drive
Power (hp): 360@6,000rpm
Torque (lb ft): 332@2,250-5,000rpm
0-62mph: 4.6 seconds
Top speed: 155mph (limited)
Weight: 1,555kg
MPG: 40.9 (NEDC combined)
CO2: 161g/km
Price: £37,845
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      07-10-2013, 01:48 AM   #42
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Instant performance

Quote:
Originally Posted by ovekvam View Post
The same performance is available at all revs with the manual gearbox.
The 330d torque peaks at 1250 (or maybe 1500), so offers instant power in almost any gear

The point I was making is that the 8 speed Sport AT shifts so fast that power feels instantaneous at any revs. That not the same with the MT, where you may need to down shift 1 or 2 gears, which is far from instantaneous.
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      07-10-2013, 01:56 AM   #43
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But why would you be in a gear that puts the RPM under 1300 RPM or so? With normal driving, there would be no reason to downshift.
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      07-11-2013, 11:10 PM   #44
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A45 is so damn good looking IDK
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