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Originally Posted by AussieSimon
It should be mentioned that the notion of "run in" of sound systems is simply not borne out by the facts. Precision measurements of hi-fi equipment immediately following purchase and then after a period of use generally shows no change at all. Some speaker cones can be stiff when new, but that will be resolved within a few minutes of use.
In reality, what "runs in" is not the speakers... it's your ears and brain.
What you've experienced is a growing familiarity and comfort with the tone of the Harman/Kardon tuned system. If you don't believe me, I'm receiving a new F20 with H/K in a few months, and I plan to analyze the system with the acoustic measurement gear I own. I'll then be able to re-test after many hours of operation and publish both results.
What you're hearing is not imaging, it's the additional physical sound radiators located in the centre dash, and the "Logic 7" processing. Real imaging is simply not a feasible characteristic of even the best car audio system, simply because of the grossly asymmetric listening position.
At the most basic level, achieving real stereo imaging tends to require high consistency between the left and right channels, and to avoid crossover within key frequency ranges. A high end home theatre setup can have its imaging potential disrupted by placing the speakers asymmetrically and/or near side walls.
Pace, rhythm and timing are meaningless words you'll only ever find in press releases and "What Hi-Fi" grade reviews. They're meaningless because they rarely mean the same thing to different people. The real question is linear response, cabinet resonance and room acoustics.
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Hey Simon....hope you're up for a good discussion.
Firstly to the concept of running in. There has been an objective vs. subjective debate about this for years in the Audiophile community with absolutely no agreement or conclusion.....so let me relate one experience. Some years ago I purchased a brand new pair of Sonus Faber Extremas for my existing Balanced Audio Technology system. I installed the speakers and took a listen....the sound was not to my liking. Instead of putting myself through hours of torture, I simply placed the speakers face to face, reversed the polarity of one speaker, selected mono on the amp and left the speakers playing for 60 hours. Because the speakers are facing one another and out of phase, there's virtually no sound but current is flowing and the speakers are working hard. After 60 hours I tried them again and again I did not like the sound. Another 60 hours running in and the improvement was absolutely clear to hear. The system had lost a particular edginess and brittleness that I found most unpleasant and gained a wonderful musicality that was not present on the first audition. In the complete absence of any familiarizing period the sound changed completely and didn't change the more I listened.
Second experience.....blind testing of a new vs. used component. In random substitution of 2 otherwise identical components we were able to pick the new component 100% correctly, simply by identifying artefacts of the sound that were entirely absent in the used component. The effect of this artefact was to create discomfort...so you didn't have to listen that carefully....with one component the music was gorgeous while the other caused a degree of discomfort...totally reproducibly, time and again.
Imaging......imaging is something created 100% psychoacoustically i.e in your head. In nature a sound always emanates from a single point. The difference in level and phase reaching each ear is used by the brain to assign distance and directionality to the sound. In audio, we have 2 or more sound sources, so we can manipulate the information that arrives at each ear, creating an illusion of direction and distance that doesn't actually exist. It is therefore entirely possible, by manipulating levels and phase, to create the illusion of imaging in a car. The imaging created may not be accurate in terms of the original recording...or the same as that created by a stereo system but it is certainly capable of providing the illusion of spacial depth and width. Essentially both stereo and multi speaker systems are all doing the same thing....manipulating the sound waves that reach your ear to create spacial illusion. The only place that imaging really exists is in your head. It does not exist in a room. Why do walls and reflective objects destroy imaging? Because they blur and distort the sound waves reaching the ears, so the brain can no longer relate the input from each ear to construct a clear sense of depth and direction.
Pace, rhythm and timing involve human perception. Play the same piece of music on one system and it will leave you unmoved, while another will have you bouncing out of your chair (or driver's seat). The first system sounds slow and lifeless, while the other gives the music real drive and impulse and sounds highly rhythmical and involving. Given that the record, CD or memory is being tracked, read or clocked at identical speeds, the difference comes down to presentation and perception. Onc system sounds like it lacks pace, rhythm and timing, while the other has these characteristics in spades. PRaT probably can't be measured at least not that I'm aware of, but it can most certainly be heard in terms of how involving and engaging one system is vs. another. I suspect that it has to do with the tonal balance of mid-bass vs. the rest of the spectrum but that's pure speculation